[allinon72]

Originally Posted by domino_z

That is all true and in a free market you are spot on

However with big top down gov authoritarian bans on ice, there is no free market, ppl will be forced into ev’s through lack of choice and sweeping taxation

Sure you may live in a country that doesn’t introduce the same ice bans or holds out a little bit longer than eu, but it wont matter because these manufacturers won’t be building you anything worth buying

Euro6 comes into play in 25, from that point on you won’t see any new ice platforms being developed, certainly not anything sports car based, at best you’ll get small engine hybrids as a short term stop gap

I hear what you are saying but money controls politicians in the US. Our auto industry is going to go bankrupt on their current path, very quickly, and they know it. What little true capitalism that remains exists in the form of consumer demand, it has to be there at least partially or the whole thing falls apart.

And what happens here will ripple across the world because of our influence. The global “leaders” pushing this won’t give up but will be forced to back off.

[Rux]

Can’t we all just get along??? It’s “insert holiday you care about here”.


Besides, BMW does whatever China decides they like.

[G30M]

smart move. while MB and WAG has stopped making ICE BMW will be laughing all the way to the bank.

now if they can just hire someone who can draw cars ...

[Th3DarkSide]

Originally Posted by F32Fleet

Yes. Lifecycle emissions of an EV are significantly less than those of ICE.

I posted about EV battery production and the detrimental effects it has on the environment. I see you just choose to ignore that part of the argument completely. Typical.

[IcEWoLF]

No auto maker should consider ditching internal combustion engines for at least the next decade.

Most people live in apartments and they don’t have the ability to charge their cars.

Outside of Tesla charging network, most of the other charging stations are flat out trash and not well maintained.

Even auto makers like Volvo are sticking with internal combustion since they won’t sell or able to compete with the likes of Tesla.

[dezzracer]

Originally Posted by GolfCoyote

Forcing EV's on everyone is backfiring big time. I hope more manufacturers (including BMW) do what Toyota is doing and invest in Hybrids.

Hybrids are the smart answer for the foreseeable future if you ask me. Tech is there for 50 mpg high hp 4 and 6 cylinder motors supplemented by e power. Short trips around town? Use your battery power and safe the environment . Charge your car at home each night with minimal inconvenience. Want to take a long uninterrupted trip and not worry about charging stations ? Both power supplies (fuel and electricity) are readily available along the way. And let’s not forget new clean burning fuel technology. This all in right fkn now approach on total EV without thinking it through is government stupidity at its finest.

[GolfCoyote]

Originally Posted by dezzracer

Hybrids are the smart answer for the foreseeable future if you ask me. Tech is there for 50 mpg high hp 4 and 6 cylinder motors supplemented by e power. Short trips around town? Use your battery power and safe the environment . Charge your car at home each night with minimal inconvenience. Want to take a long uninterrupted trip and not worry about charging stations ? Both power supplies (fuel and electricity) are readily available along the way. And let’s not forget new clean burning fuel technology. This all in right fkn now approach on total EV without thinking it through is government stupidity at its finest.

Not to mention the lack of infrastructure. CA for example seems hell bent on shutting down power plants, meanwhile they have rolling blackouts every summer.

[Bimmer5]

Most people take offense to being forced or coerced into doing something, so the EV mandates (which more than likely they have no authority to do) causes push back.
I personally want nothing to do with EV’s but if that’s someone’s thing more power to them, I think the tax incentives and push by the government should stop. Let the market decide what happens, but to think you’re saving the planet by driving a EV is ridiculous.

[Ugly Kar]

Originally Posted by Th3DarkSide

I posted about EV battery production and the detrimental effects it has on the environment. I see you just choose to ignore that part of the argument completely. Typical.

Do you really expect those types to be capable of researching and analyzing ALL the variables? No way in hell, that ain't happenin'.

[2 overtake]

ICE lovers are suffering from Stockholm syndrome after reading this thread

[M2siast]

Originally Posted by carseatsm5

They don’t have much of a choice unless California and others walk back the 2035 ban.

We know Americans thing they’re the centre of the universe, but to say that BMW will stop making ICE because California will ban ICE is beyond much…

Even if other places follow suit, the world is a vast place. ICE will continue on. BMW is simply stating its business model isn’t EV-exclusive (like Tesla). They’re not Tesla competitors. That’s it, and that’s all.

[ghaffari46]

Originally Posted by Scrapula

You have obviously never driven one. I drove a few BMW EVs at car shows, expos, and the BMW Autocross event. Saying they all suck is like my husband hating all green vegetables, even though he has tried tasting zero of them.

4 years ago when my brother in law got his tesla s I kinda made fun of him.
Now I have 2 EVs.
The problem with most of people is they have not tried/live with one.

[Scrapula]

Originally Posted by Th3DarkSide

I posted about EV battery production and the detrimental effects it has on the environment. I see you just choose to ignore that part of the argument completely. Typical.

You are correct, it is bad or very bad depending on the source of materials. In the best case scenario, it would take an ICE car 2 years of running on petrol to equal the damage of building the EV battery. Worst case, about 5 years.

[Scrapula]

Originally Posted by ghaffari46

4 years ago when my brother in law got his tesla s I kinda made fun of him.
Now I have 2 EVs.
The problem with most of people is they have not tried/live with one.

I truly dislike Tesla. Good engineering but poor execution.

I am getting an EV as it is a natural progression for me. I drove only manual transmissions for decades. Where was the skill of pressing an accelerator to the floor? Eventually, automatics became so efficient. They were better at shifting and even got better gas mileage. I held out and at least had paddle shifters with no clutch. But, almost every car has an automatic transmission. If all you are doing is mashing the pedal, you might as well have all the torque available at the onset. It doesn’t matter to me what type of engine. The instant torque is intoxicating.

[carseatsm5]

Originally Posted by M2siast

We know Americans thing they’re the centre of the universe, but to say that BMW will stop making ICE because California will ban ICE is beyond much…

Even if other places follow suit, the world is a vast place. ICE will continue on. BMW is simply stating its business model isn’t EV-exclusive (like Tesla). They’re not Tesla competitors. That’s it, and that’s all.

“And others.” EU has same ban date last I checked.

[BimmerMan33]

BMW may not give up on ICE but as emission regulations continue to toughen up they’d have to downsize while engines continue to become more efficient. V8s might stay but will be available on fewer & fewer models & more I6s might be replaced with hybridized I4s.
Also, we have seen how quickly manufacturers change their stand after making opposite statements… they’ll change based on governmental regulations & market trends.. sustainability & profitability over tradition, emotions & enthusiasm I guess!

[ghaffari46]

Originally Posted by M2siast

You proved his point.

I don’t need to prove anything.
If calling people who read and understand science ( as simple as ozone layer) crazy makes you feel better, go for it bro, it’s Christmas Day and you deserve to be happy.


Apparently We live on 2 different planets, let’s call it here.

[M2siast]

Originally Posted by ghaffari46

I don’t need to prove anything.
If calling people who read and understand science ( as simple as ozone layer) crazy makes you feel better, go for it bro, it’s Christmas Day and you deserve to be happy.


Apparently We live on 2 different planets, let’s call it here.

Hope your day improves, and that rage leaves your body. Relax and enjoy Christmas!

God bless you

[Cortexiphan]

Originally Posted by Scrapula

Ad hominem attacks are a logical fallacy. It’s considered the lowest possible type of argument instead of addressing the issue in question.

Don’t even bother. Mental problems… His identity is associated with exhaust gasses at this point.

[Cortexiphan]

Originally Posted by Germanauto

Most of us don't hate EVs, we just hate them being forced down everybody's throat as the end all be all solution to climate change. When in reality it's all about politics and corporate greenwashing to sell another product.

EVs are great, but let's not act like banning every last fun ICE car is going to save the planet.

They have to be forced down people’s throats. Because people are idiots, as seen in this thread.
If you don’t ’force down’ seatbelts down their throats, they don’t wear them and just die in a 20 mph crash.

[Cortexiphan]

Originally Posted by ghaffari46

You sounds like one of those angry commentators of cycle TV news.
You don’t need to insult people for the cars they drive.
Just chill.
By the way, cows farming produces methane which affects ozone layer.
It is in the high school science books.
Merry Christmas.

I’m not sure he went to high school. But again, maybe he did and high schools in some places just produce anti-science, conspiracy obsessed people. Probably, for him, climate change analysis from nazis he follows on YouTube or ‘x’ who never even read anything on climate, are more believable than actual climate scientists. As in their world, they believe colleges don’t even teach anything except for ‘woke agenda’. You know, you can literally setup a small experiment at home to prove to yourself how carbon and methane hold way more heat than other common atmospheric gases, but they don’t think like that, reality doesn’t matter at all. They fear the truth. This is so sad.
Small brains weren’t ready for the Internet. Now they’re ruining our world.

[M2siast]

Originally Posted by thatBeemer

Don’t think you can’t say Christmas to him he’s gonna get offended

I kinda did it on purpose…
Merry Christmas!