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      07-15-2019, 04:27 PM   #23
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so let's fire them.
This has been my plan in the poling place for about 15 years.

Incumbent? Pick someone else, ANYONE else, regardless of the letter behind their name.
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      07-15-2019, 04:38 PM   #24
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It's about as bad as it can get.
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      07-22-2019, 08:27 AM   #25
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Thought another post was here and now it's gone. Odd.
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      07-22-2019, 10:18 AM   #26
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Originally Posted by Run Silent View Post
Thought another post was here and now it's gone. Odd.
The chem trails are finally taking effect?


I was never a Rush fan:
https://thehill.com/opinion/finance/...know-he-needed

The other day, Rush Limbaugh admitted that he’s largely in the debt camp. Responding to a caller on his show last Thursday, Rush said the following:

“I probably should not admit this, because it changes for me day to day. But I have to tell you, this whole budget thing, I think I’m immune to it now … We’re told that the national debt’s gonna wipe us out, that the deficit’s gonna wipe us out. We’ve gotta get a handle on the deficit. It’s growing because the national debt is growing.

“And I know theoretically all this is bad, but in the real world all of the apocalyptic warnings I grew up hearing have yet to happen. The national debt has not choked us. The national debt has not destroyed us. We may be living in the middle of the destruction and don’t see it yet, but for some reason I didn’t get caught up in it.”

Nothing in his comments is particularly surprising. These arguments are common, at least from commentators who skew toward the left. What is surprising is that this admission came from Rush Limbaugh, the self-styled voice of the conservative movement.
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      07-22-2019, 10:23 AM   #27
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Originally Posted by Run Silent View Post



Can anyone name a single good thing that benefited America that congress has done over the last 2 decades? One thing. Just one.

Yeah. That's right. Fukol. Apparently we elected a bunch of shitheads. so let's fire them.

Enjoy the website: http://fuckyoucongress.com/





/rant.

Although gutted by the SCOTUS, I thought this was a good bill.

Bipartisan Campaign Reform Act
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bipart...ign_Reform_Act
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      07-22-2019, 10:46 AM   #28
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Originally Posted by Schwarzschild Radius View Post
The chem trails are finally taking effect?


I was never a Rush fan:
https://thehill.com/opinion/finance/...know-he-needed

The other day, Rush Limbaugh admitted that he’s largely in the debt camp. Responding to a caller on his show last Thursday, Rush said the following:

“I probably should not admit this, because it changes for me day to day. But I have to tell you, this whole budget thing, I think I’m immune to it now … We’re told that the national debt’s gonna wipe us out, that the deficit’s gonna wipe us out. We’ve gotta get a handle on the deficit. It’s growing because the national debt is growing.

“And I know theoretically all this is bad, but in the real world all of the apocalyptic warnings I grew up hearing have yet to happen. The national debt has not choked us. The national debt has not destroyed us. We may be living in the middle of the destruction and don’t see it yet, but for some reason I didn’t get caught up in it.”

Nothing in his comments is particularly surprising. These arguments are common, at least from commentators who skew toward the left. What is surprising is that this admission came from Rush Limbaugh, the self-styled voice of the conservative movement.
1) He is a commentator, not a currently elected official, so I don't really give a shit what he has to say as it relates to current congressional actions, however....

2) That is a total shit thing to say. He should be substantially chastised for it, as it essentially eliminates him as a conservative voice, as he is profession the exact opposite of conservatism. What a moronic statement for him to make.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Schwarzschild Radius View Post
Although gutted by the SCOTUS, I thought this was a good bill.

Bipartisan Campaign Reform Act
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bipart...ign_Reform_Act
So then, the end result, is that they didn't really accomplish much of anything, since the legislation was written in such a way, that it was easily overturned by the supreme court. Their only job is the draft legislation, and they can't even do that right. Good grief.

So still a useless bunch of assholes, then? Right. Screw them all.
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      07-22-2019, 12:53 PM   #29
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Originally Posted by Run Silent View Post
1) He is a commentator, not a currently elected official, so I don't really give a shit what he has to say as it relates to current congressional actions, however....

2) That is a total shit thing to say. He should be substantially chastised for it, as it essentially eliminates him as a conservative voice, as he is profession the exact opposite of conservatism. What a moronic statement for him to make.



3. So then, the end result, is that they didn't really accomplish much of anything, since the legislation was written in such a way, that it was easily overturned by the supreme court. Their only job is the draft legislation, and they can't even do that right. Good grief.

So still a useless bunch of assholes, then? Right. Screw them all.
2. Agreed
3. Its disappointing another attempt was not made. Sure, Sen. Shelby has to spend time protecting his SLS rocket (A almost total scam on the US taxpayer by Boeing), apparently we have to buy more F-15's because of the JSF boondoggle, and we have to pass budgets with huge tax cuts, while increasing the federal budget. Sounds good for me! But disastrous for my kids.........

https://www.cagw.org/reporting/pig-book#Defense
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      07-22-2019, 01:43 PM   #30
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Originally Posted by Schwarzschild Radius View Post
2. Agreed
3. Its disappointing another attempt was not made. Sure, Sen. Shelby has to spend time protecting his SLS rocket (A almost total scam on the US taxpayer by Boeing), apparently we have to buy more F-15's because of the JSF boondoggle, and we have to pass budgets with huge tax cuts, while increasing the federal budget. Sounds good for me! But disastrous for my kids.........

https://www.cagw.org/reporting/pig-book#Defense
The tax cuts were a smart idea, but they should have been coupled with drastic spending cuts. So once again, they can't do anything right.

Sigh.

I see now that both parties are nearing an agreement to increase the debt ceiling and also install automatic budgetary increases for several federal government departments.

Fuckers.
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      07-22-2019, 02:13 PM   #31
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It's about as bad as it can get.
It’s worse than that.
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      07-22-2019, 02:27 PM   #32
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Schwarzschild Radius View Post
I was never a Rush fan:
https://thehill.com/opinion/finance/...know-he-needed

The other day, Rush Limbaugh admitted that he’s largely in the debt camp. Responding to a caller on his show last Thursday, Rush said the following:

“I probably should not admit this, because it changes for me day to day. But I have to tell you, this whole budget thing, I think I’m immune to it now … We’re told that the national debt’s gonna wipe us out, that the deficit’s gonna wipe us out. We’ve gotta get a handle on the deficit. It’s growing because the national debt is growing.

“And I know theoretically all this is bad, but in the real world all of the apocalyptic warnings I grew up hearing have yet to happen. The national debt has not choked us. The national debt has not destroyed us. We may be living in the middle of the destruction and don’t see it yet, but for some reason I didn’t get caught up in it.”

Nothing in his comments is particularly surprising. These arguments are common, at least from commentators who skew toward the left. What is surprising is that this admission came from Rush Limbaugh, the self-styled voice of the conservative movement.
It's not the slightest bit surprising because there is a Republican president and congress doing all the deficit expansion. He'll flip flop the next time there's a Democrat in the seat. He's just an entertainer.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Run Silent View Post
1) He is a commentator, not a currently elected official, so I don't really give a shit what he has to say as it relates to current congressional actions, however....

2) That is a total shit thing to say. He should be substantially chastised for it, as it essentially eliminates him as a conservative voice, as he is profession the exact opposite of conservatism. What a moronic statement for him to make.
He's apologizing for his favorite political party, and assuaging the guilty pangs of his listener base over the free spending the pubs exercise every time they are in power. He'll flip when it's dems doing it. He's just an entertainer, and a predictable one at that.
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      07-22-2019, 02:35 PM   #33
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I see the tax cuts themselves as problematically targeted. Maybe its me but it appears that the beneficiary of the cuts were corporate stock prices in the form of corporate buy backs whose effects are short term at best. Very little went into the human capital arena which could have received stimulus and which would likely be more long lasting and beneficial. Throw in a few ill-timed tariffs and voila-growth not meeting expectations and of course, huge deficits.

The recovery continues but there there appears to be an ominous cloud approaching with the huge deficits and little real growth.
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      07-22-2019, 02:42 PM   #34
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I see the tax cuts themselves as problematically targeted. Maybe its me but it appears that the beneficiary of the cuts were corporate stock prices in the form of corporate buy backs whose effects are short term at best. Very little went into the human capital arena which could have received stimulus and which would likely be more long lasting and beneficial.
I disagree.

Critics of the TCJA have claimed that the law’s tax cuts only benefit high-income individuals and businesses, however, the total tax liability fell for all income groups except those earning over $1 million in 2018...The initial data shows that the TCJA expanded the use of several credits and deductions, made the standard deduction more favorable than itemizing, reduced tax refunds, and lowered taxes for most Americans.

https://taxfoundation.org/2018-tax-return-data/
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      07-22-2019, 05:20 PM   #35
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I agree that Its always a good idea to have lower taxes, and I did review your attachment. The point is that the growth of the national economy is rather tepid compared to the results that were talked up or hyped. The new tax law sure didn't do much for me.
Last time I checked, and I may be wrong, the economy had grown an average of 40 something basis points over the Obama GDP results. It seems to be under performing for such a greatly increased deficit, and of course the Fed is under pressure to reduce interest rates which typically doesn't happen during booms-or does it?
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      07-22-2019, 05:50 PM   #36
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Originally Posted by irishbimmer View Post
I agree that Its always a good idea to have lower taxes, and I did review your attachment. The point is that the growth of the national economy is rather tepid compared to the results that were talked up or hyped. The new tax law sure didn't do much for me.
Last time I checked, and I may be wrong, the economy had grown an average of 40 something basis points over the Obama GDP results. It seems to be under performing for such a greatly increased deficit, and of course the Fed is under pressure to reduce interest rates which typically doesn't happen during booms-or does it?
1) Remember - I don't think that the current congress is really doing anything right. Tax cuts were good, but coupled with increased spending was a terrible idea.

2) Irrespective of economic growth, I was simply stating that the tax cuts didn't just go to the wealthy and corps, as the talking points suggest and I believe was what you were inferring in your post. There were many errors in the tax cuts, and we can discuss at length, but to say "very little went into the human capital arena" as you mentioned, I think is misleading.

3) Economic growth now, as compared to the Obama admin isn't really apples to apples. You don't really have to do much to have strong growth coming out of such a bad recession. Substantially more is needed to incur strong growth when the economy was already doing pretty good.

I think that Trump is a fool and I think that many in the Senate and House are morons as well, but it is hard to say that the current administration hasn't done well respective to the current economy. The issue lies - is at what cost? As mentioned, the insane deficit spending is going to come crashing down at some point. None of the politicians on either side want to resolve this, as it is the third rail of politics. They're all just a bunch of pansies.


You and I should take over. You're liberal social programs, and my reduced spending plans could merge into something great. I bet we see eye to eye on very little things - but I also bet we could come to a compromise on tha vast majority of the issues today.

If we can - why can't the people that we elect do it? Shows how "LAZY and POWER HUNGRY" they really are, doesn't it?
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      07-22-2019, 06:10 PM   #37
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Too many Attorney's who want to argue and win-we need more accountants!! HaHA
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      07-22-2019, 08:59 PM   #38
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Originally Posted by Run Silent View Post
I bet we see eye to eye on very little things - but I also bet we could come to a compromise on tha vast majority of the issues today.

If we can - why can't the people that we elect do it? Shows how "LAZY and POWER HUNGRY" they really are, doesn't it?
I see two major shifts in how our federal government works that have changed its function at a fundamental level. The first is Reagan's "voodoo economics" and the associated complete abandonment of honest fiscal conservatism from the so-called conservatives. The second is vicious, pointless, partisanism. Party before country. I lay it at the feet of Newt Gingrich but others may disagree. It was bad under Clinton but turned downright evil under Obama; from the "Liar!" cry on, it drew a hard, heavy line across the capital. McConnell, that idiot, carries the torch now.
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      07-23-2019, 08:19 AM   #39
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I see two major shifts in how our federal government works that have changed its function at a fundamental level. The first is Reagan's "voodoo economics" and the associated complete abandonment of honest fiscal conservatism from the so-called conservatives. The second is vicious, pointless, partisanism. Party before country. I lay it at the feet of Newt Gingrich but others may disagree. It was bad under Clinton but turned downright evil under Obama; from the "Liar!" cry on, it drew a hard, heavy line across the capital. McConnell, that idiot, carries the torch now.
So no blame on the "impeach the motherf*cker" democrats, then eh?



They are both easily to blame - if you cannot say that honestly - then you are a major part of the problem.
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      07-23-2019, 10:33 AM   #40
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Originally Posted by wdb View Post
I see two major shifts in how our federal government works that have changed its function at a fundamental level. The first is Reagan's "voodoo economics" and the associated complete abandonment of honest fiscal conservatism from the so-called conservatives. The second is vicious, pointless, partisanism. Party before country. I lay it at the feet of Newt Gingrich but others may disagree. It was bad under Clinton but turned downright evil under Obama; from the "Liar!" cry on, it drew a hard, heavy line across the capital. McConnell, that idiot, carries the torch now.
You might want to read Democracy in America by Alexis de Tocqueville (1835). These problems and tendencies are not at all new; the “rabble of democracy” used to be checked in part by being a Republic, which we have watered down (democraticized) considerably.

On “voodoo” economics, that adjective came from George Bush, who was no economist, but was running for office. The basic ideas of supply side economics go back to Say (Say’s law) and are sound (but only part of economic theory); and the ideas around marginal tax rates also are sound although solid empirical evidence for what the correct marginal rate is remain elusive (too many variables to really tease it out). It is likely the most tax-efficient top marginal rate is below 50%, but deductions, credits and non-income taxes muddy the water considerably.

Partisanship started with the birth of the nation and has certainly been ugly in other periods. See how Lincoln was vilified and charactured in the press, for example. Jefferson, an early agrarian who favored small government and checks and balances, as president commissioned the Voyage of Discovery (Lewis and Clark Expedition) without congressional approval nor funding! Nothing new in human nature.

I think the trend toward “Idiocracy” will continue in Western countries at least. Boris Johnson, the British Trump, will take over as PM in October. There is no incentive for the populace nor elected officials to reverse course, as de Tocqueville discussed over 180 years ago!
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      07-23-2019, 10:39 AM   #41
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I think the trend toward “Idiocracy” will continue in Western countries at least. Boris Johnson, the British Trump, will take over as PM in October. There is no incentive for the populace nor elected officials to reverse course, as de Tocqueville discussed over 180 years ago!
I don't see Boris as a "Trump", but he has a certain pragmatism towards attaining power that doesn't seem to be based on what is good for Britain. He might be ok, he might be great, but if he screws up Brexit, Corbyn might be the next English PM, which would be almost the same size disaster as a Trump presidency has been.
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      07-23-2019, 10:42 AM   #42
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I don't see Boris as a "Trump", but he has a certain pragmatism towards attaining power that doesn't seem to be based on what is good for Britain. He might be ok, he might be great, but if he screws up Brexit, Corbyn might be the next English PM, which would be almost the same size disaster as a Trump presidency has been.
Fair point - I was thinking more of his style than substance. I think that outrageous style is increasingly what it will take to get elected in western democracies; its one reason I think Biden will sink (too boring!).
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      07-23-2019, 12:03 PM   #43
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wdb View Post
I see two major shifts in how our federal government works that have changed its function at a fundamental level. The first is Reagan's "voodoo economics" and the associated complete abandonment of honest fiscal conservatism from the so-called conservatives. The second is vicious, pointless, partisanism. Party before country. I lay it at the feet of Newt Gingrich but others may disagree. It was bad under Clinton but turned downright evil under Obama; from the "Liar!" cry on, it drew a hard, heavy line across the capital. McConnell, that idiot, carries the torch now.
You might want to read Democracy in America by Alexis de Tocqueville (1835). These problems and tendencies are not at all new; the "rabble of democracy" used to be checked in part by being a Republic, which we have watered down (democraticized) considerably.

On "voodoo" economics, that adjective came from George Bush, who was no economist, but was running for office. The basic ideas of supply side economics go back to Say (Say's law) and are sound (but only part of economic theory); and the ideas around marginal tax rates also are sound although solid empirical evidence for what the correct marginal rate is remain elusive (too many variables to really tease it out). It is likely the most tax-efficient top marginal rate is below 50%, but deductions, credits and non-income taxes muddy the water considerably.

Partisanship started with the birth of the nation and has certainly been ugly in other periods. See how Lincoln was vilified and charactured in the press, for example. Jefferson, an early agrarian who favored small government and checks and balances, as president commissioned the Voyage of Discovery (Lewis and Clark Expedition) without congressional approval nor funding! Nothing new in human nature.

I think the trend toward "Idiocracy" will continue in Western countries at least. Boris Johnson, the British Trump, will take over as PM in October. There is no incentive for the populace nor elected officials to reverse course, as de Tocqueville discussed over 180 years ago!
Much of what de tocqueville wrote is absolutely correct. His musings should and for a long time were considered common sense.

Sadly we live in a time where his writings no longer hold the same weight except among a small few who have bothered to read him and so many others. These writings of course served as the light for so many who worked hard over many years to create the foundational elements to allow America to flourish.

These days his writings are twisted to make memes that are diametrically opposed to everything he argued about. Nobody even bats an eye because no one has actually read the writings.

It's like when you see a skinhead blasting rage against the machine or korn.

But we truly live in age of mental laziness but hats off to you atleast. In my personal opinion anyone who puts fourth some kind of political opinion out there who hasn't read him should be ignored. You don't have to agree with him, but read him you must.

And before some idiotic absolutist decides to chime in, a lot of what he said is wrong too, but the concepts must be read and explored.

He has described almost everything we have experienced in our modern political life. So many of our mistakes were predictable and in fact warned against.

In the end, sadly, you stand alongside a very few amongst the internet noise. But hat tip nevertheless.
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      07-23-2019, 03:08 PM   #44
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3) Economic growth now, as compared to the Obama admin isn't really apples to apples. You don't really have to do much to have strong growth coming out of such a bad recession. Substantially more is needed to incur strong growth when the economy was already doing pretty good.
Economic growth now, versus Obama's first term....I don't necessarily disagree. Although, government spending for both of their first terms is on the rise (higher rate of discretionary spending growth under Trump than Obama, even) we did see a tapering off of spending growth in O's 2nd term if I recall correctly.

I've made this point before in other threads, but if we compare last years growth (2018) its essentially the same as it was in 2015. However, there's a key difference....government spending as a percentage of the economy was lower in 2015 than it was last year which carries with it some implications. The most obvious observation is that ex-government spending, 2015 was potentially a superior year to 2018. There have certainly been on-trend improvements over the past several years but this isn't a vastly different economy now, versus what it was in 2015 or 2016 for instance. We aren't seeing 3%+ GDP growth, we aren't seeing wages rocket up, and things like that.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Run Silent
I think that Trump is a fool and I think that many in the Senate and House are morons as well, but it is hard to say that the current administration hasn't done well respective to the current economy. The issue lies - is at what cost? As mentioned, the insane deficit spending is going to come crashing down at some point. None of the politicians on either side want to resolve this, as it is the third rail of politics. They're all just a bunch of pansies.
I agree with this, but its not just the politicians in place. As the old saying goes, the people get the government they deserve. I think the new dismal science is that of politics, unfortunately.
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