[GSMCCASH]

My car came with Bridgestone Potenza S007 NRFT 20”. I’ve tried to locate ANY information on driving in cold temperatures. There seems to a lack of information from reviews and manufacturer info.
The manufacture state “not intended for winter driving”. I understand that when it comes to snow and ice. But specifically looking for info on temperature. I know some tires have glass transitioning or a lack thereof which can cause problems in low temperatures. Some more extreme than others. Does a tire with extremely low transitioning mean the car should not be moved during the winter?
Can these tires be driven at 35, 32 or even 25 degrees? Will the rubber crack or even chunk rubber pieces over a certain speed….like 35 mph?
Interestingly, I found 1 report that showed the RFT version of this tire scored an 80 on snow performance….. really. My internal BS sensor is going off on that report!

Any insight on this or other Summer Tires?

[Brucelinc]

This is what Tire Rack says:

Like all Extreme Performance Summer tires, the Potenza S007A RFT is not intended to be serviced, stored nor driven in near- and below-freezing temperatures, through snow or on ice.

[GSMCCASH]

Originally Posted by Brucelinc

This is what Tire Rack says:

Like all Extreme Performance Summer tires, the Potenza S007A RFT is not intended to be serviced, stored nor driven in near- and below-freezing temperatures, through snow or on ice.

According that, I should not live in any climate where the temperature may be at or near freezing at anytime or not do any type of service or store the tires as well.
I typically store my car in winter with trickle charger.

[Joe-BMW33]

In a nutshell, Summer Performance Tires are made of super soft grippy rubber. Cold temps make them harden. Think Tonka Truck tires. When they get hard in cold temps, they can slip really easy under force.

They are not supposed to be driven under 40F. I'll take mine out on a nice sunny winter day in the high 30's though, but 35 and under is dangerous.

[ezaircon4jc]

Originally Posted by Joe-BMW33

In a nutshell, Summer Performance Tires are made of super soft grippy rubber. Cold temps make them harden. Think Tonka Truck tires. When they get hard in cold temps, they can slip really easy under force.

They are not supposed to be driven under 40F. I'll take mine out on a nice sunny winter day in the high 30's though, but 35 and under is dangerous.

I've experienced this and it isn't any fun at all; especially on a mountain road! I figured we'd be gone before the temp dropped below 40ish (the high was high 50's/low 60's). I just couldn't impress enough on my wife the importance of leaving before the sun started setting. We also took a trip to Texas and the mountain temps in east San Diego county were supposed to be high 40's so we took my car (summer tires) instead of my wife's (all-seasons). After over 30 years of dealing with the inaccuracy of the WX service, you'd think I know better. The temps dipped into the mid-high 30's in the mountains... YIKES! I pulled-up the tire temps in the iDrive and as were we were at freeway speed, they never dipped below the mid 50's, so I wasn't too concerned.


I'm pretty sure I'll stay away from pure-summer tires in the future.

[GSMCCASH]

Originally Posted by Joe-BMW33

In a nutshell, Summer Performance Tires are made of super soft grippy rubber. Cold temps make them harden. Think Tonka Truck tires. When they get hard in cold temps, they can slip really easy under force.

They are not supposed to be driven under 40F. I'll take mine out on a nice sunny winter day in the high 30's though, but 35 and under is dangerous.

Good info on your experience. Ever heard anything on cracking or pieces of rubber expelled at higher speeds. Some people with GY F1’s had this issue in cold temps.
This morning, the temp was 29 degrees, but afternoon was 51. I did take it out this afternoon, but not in the morning.

[Mike 540]

Gents,
the biggest problem of using all-season and summer tyres in winter is that they are made of harder (not softer) rubber because they are ment to be driven in warm and hot temperatures and have to have proper adhesion (and durability) in such temperatures. When it gets cold, they harden even more and become slippery. Another problem is that their thread which is not made for snow driving. When it gets cold, one may drive with these tyres, but very carefully when cornering and braking...
Winter tyres, on the other hand, are softer as they must have adhesion on very cold temperatures. Therefore, these do not last long when driven in summer as they soften even more and rub off easily against the road.
Separate question is threads of individual tyres...
I live in Central Europe where most drivers would use two sets of wheels - one for winter and another one for summer.

[Joe-BMW33]

Originally Posted by Mike 540

Gents,
the biggest problem of using all-season and summer tyres in winter is that they are made of harder (not softer) rubber because they are ment to be driven in warm and hot temperatures and have to have proper adhesion (and durability) in such temperatures. When it gets cold, they harden even more and become slippery. Another problem is that their thread which is not made for snow driving. When it gets cold, one may drive with these tyres, but very carefully when cornering and braking...
Winter tyres, on the other hand, are softer as they must have adhesion on very cold temperatures. Therefore, these do not last long when driven in summer as they soften even more and rub off easily against the road.
Separate question is threads of individual tyres...
I live in Central Europe where most drivers would use two sets of wheels - one for winter and another one for summer.

I consider the description of "pliable elastic" to mean soft.

https://www.tirerack.com/upgrade-gar...d-temperatures

[ezaircon4jc]

Originally Posted by Mike 540

Gents,
the biggest problem of using all-season and summer tyres in winter is that they are made of harder (not softer) rubber because they are ment to be driven in warm and hot temperatures and have to have proper adhesion (and durability) in such temperatures. When it gets cold, they harden even more and become slippery. Another problem is that their thread which is not made for snow driving. When it gets cold, one may drive with these tyres, but very carefully when cornering and braking...
Winter tyres, on the other hand, are softer as they must have adhesion on very cold temperatures. Therefore, these do not last long when driven in summer as they soften even more and rub off easily against the road.
Separate question is threads of individual tyres...
I live in Central Europe where most drivers would use two sets of wheels - one for winter and another one for summer.

I drove successfully in Salt Lake City winters on all-seasons for 5 years. We had a considerable amount of snow, with the occasional ice "rain."

[Joe-BMW33]

Originally Posted by ezaircon4jc

I drove successfully in Salt Lake City winters on all-seasons for 5 years. We had a considerable amount of snow, with the occasional ice "rain."

Ditto. The only car I do not have All Seasons on is the G30. All Seasons with AWD cars gets me through the New England winter just fine. RWD cars definitely need snows, but I get by fine with AS's on my E39, but I am not driving it in the middle of a storm.

[Deke]

I don't get the whole summer-winter tire rotation for daily drivers. For those that do this, what do you do when it's the fall/spring and days are 30s-40sF in the mornings (too cold for summers) and then 50-60sF in the afternoon (too warm for winter tires)? Where I live, that's nearly 3-4 months/yr. I do all-seasons until it starts getting brutal in mid December. Then the winters come on until no-later than early March. Unless you're tracking, routinely driving like a hooligan, or your wheel size requires it, I struggle to see a compelling argument for getting summer tires vs performance oriented all-seasons. Just my $.02

[GSMCCASH]

Originally Posted by Deke

I don't get the whole summer-winter tire rotation for daily drivers. For those that do this, what do you do when it's the fall/spring and days are 30s-40sF in the mornings (too cold for summers) and then 50-60sF in the afternoon (too warm for winter tires)? Where I live, that's nearly 3-4 months/yr. I do all-seasons until it starts getting brutal in mid December. Then the winters come on until no-later than early March. Unless you're tracking, routinely driving like a hooligan, or your wheel size requires it, I struggle to see a compelling argument for getting summer tires vs performance oriented all-seasons. Just my $.02

I recently encountered that scenario of freezing temps in the morning then upper 50’s by afternoon. I decided to not drive in the morn8ng since I have OEM summer tires. Typically, I’ll put the car on a trickle charger and garaged during winter since I have another daily driver. Right now, I’m still enjoying the ride until shitty winter and road conditions happens.

[BMW012]

Originally Posted by GSMCCASH

My car came with Bridgestone Potenza S007 NRFT 20”. I’ve tried to locate ANY information on driving in cold temperatures. There seems to a lack of information from reviews and manufacturer info.
The manufacture state “not intended for winter driving”. I understand that when it comes to snow and ice. But specifically looking for info on temperature. I know some tires have glass transitioning or a lack thereof which can cause problems in low temperatures. Some more extreme than others. Does a tire with extremely low transitioning mean the car should not be moved during the winter?
Can these tires be driven at 35, 32 or even 25 degrees? Will the rubber crack or even chunk rubber pieces over a certain speed….like 35 mph?
Interestingly, I found 1 report that showed the RFT version of this tire scored an 80 on snow performance….. really. My internal BS sensor is going off on that report!

Any insight on this or other Summer Tires?

I had the OEM Bridgestone Turanzas on my 2021 M550i, they were considered "grand touring" summer tires instead of "high performance" summer tires. Drove around them for a year in NJ during all 4 seasons. Not sure if it was because they were considered "grand touring" but never noticed a difference in ride quality. Drove them around in like 10, 20 degrees and noticed nothing. I tried to lose grip on purpose but couldn't either. Granted I didn't try like my life depended on it, but either way wasn't easy like I thought it would have been.

[Mike 540]

I guess the whole thing about rotation of summer/winter tyres is in the rubber the tyres are made of. Harder summer tyres get ever harder when it cold and do not brake well so that the brake distance gets considerably longer.
Winter tyres, on the other hand, are softer and get even softer when the temperatures are high. That means they wear out much faster than summer tyres. This is one story in a nutshell.
Second parallel story is about the thread pattern - summer tyres are designed for rain only, whereas winter (or Mud+Snow) tyres have more edges (segments) to support car on snow and ice (or mud)
The reality is way more complicated and it is hard or impossible to decisively say if you do or do not need summer/winter or you just stick with all seasons. Depends where you drive, how you drive, etc. In Europe, in selected areas the winter tyres are mandatory (not all seasons) even on highway...

[tsbrown]

When I had my E46 330i ZHP, E90 M3, and F30 340i, all used the latest Michelin Pilot Sport summer tires at the time because I tracked those cars on street tires. Where I live it doesn’t get consistently below 40F until December so that’s when I swapped for full winter tires, not A/S. Then by mid March it was warm enough to swap back to the summer tires. I use only A/S tires on my G30 because it will never see the track and I won’t drive it if there’s enough snow to need more grip.

[GSMCCASH]

One of my questions is……Do summer only tires become damaged at temps below freezing?

I typically store my car during the winter on a tender. I’ve heard driving in freezing temps or moving the car in freezing temps can cause the rubber to crack or even chunk at higher speeds. Any feed back on this?

I’m familiar with the traction issue as I’ve had summer only tires before on a Shelby GT500 (Goodyear F1 Supercar 3R). Below 50 degrees there would be traction degradation, but never drove in below freezing temps.

[Joe-BMW33]

Originally Posted by GSMCCASH

One of my questions is……Do summer only tires become damaged at temps below freezing?

I typically store my car during the winter on a tender. I’ve heard driving in freezing temps or moving the car in freezing temps can cause the rubber to crack or even chunk at higher speeds. Any feed back on this?

I’m familiar with the traction issue as I’ve had summer only tires before on a Shelby GT500 (Goodyear F1 Supercar 3R). Below 50 degrees there would be traction degradation, but never drove in below freezing temps.

I think you are fine in a garage. How cold does it actually get in there? My garage is heated but I honestly close the vents unless I’m working in there. My car sits all winter with a tender on it. No tire issues.

[ezaircon4jc]

Originally Posted by Joe-BMW33

I think you are fine in a garage. How cold does it actually get in there? My garage is heated but I honestly close the vents unless I’m working in there. My car sits all winter with a tender on it. No tire issues.

Thought about overinflating your tires or putting the car on jack stands to prevent flat-spotting over the winter?

[Joe-BMW33]

Originally Posted by ezaircon4jc

Thought about overinflating your tires or putting the car on jack stands to prevent flat-spotting over the winter?

Nah, I’m going on my third or fourth winter of garaging it and I’ve had no issues with flat spots. I put a tender on it and with this global warming phenomenon, I’ll get a +40 degree day every now and then and I take it for a spin around the block a few times.