Rumor: M4 CSL moniker returning (not M4 GTS)? Not likely.

[GOLFFRR]

I need one!

[TheIceStormOf06]

Ahhhhhh. Can't wait!!!!

[8600RPM]

I'd pay 100k sticker . Not going to happen but would be a fair price

[antzcrashing]

Originally Posted by SYT_Shadow

I certainly hope it does not retail for $140k. That would be ridiculous.

Lets see when BMW gets the point, instead of foolishness like 'exclusivity' they should mass produce a $100k car that performs like a GT3 and have it available during the entire run of M3s.

Of course when you make 50 units the price is stupid, then everyone will hate on it because it's too damn expensive and costs more than a GT3...

Truth

[Falafel Combo]

A BMW is a BMW. A Porsche is a Porsche. For better or for worse, both brands have their loyalists that would pay this much and more for their respective cars. I fail to see why a potential M4 GTS immediately becomes overlooked for a GT3, merely because it happened to be in its price range. I mean, don't they at least drive different? Rear engine vs front engine, ....

The GT3 is obviously an incredible machine in its own right, with the spectacular pedigree to boot. But an M4 GTS would certainly give any performance vehicle a run for its money and would especially present a strong case when put up against any P car, GT3 or not. The truth is we just don't know anything yet about a possible M4 GTS to make any of these conclusions. For crying out loud, we don't even know what it's going to be called!

It's almost like saying "well if you optioned an M4 up to a $100k, well you may as well get a GTR".

[Appeltje]

Originally Posted by mshab356

For ghat price tag I would get a Porsche GT3

x2

[whitstap]

CF hood, cf doors, cf trunk, rear seat delete, Ti exhaust, less sound deadening material, a/c delete, possibly even thinner glass if they really want...seems like they should be able to find at least 150 lbs to shave off a similar f82 dct stripper w/ccbs and get the CLS near 3300lbs or less hopefully...guess they only benefit to buying one instead of just modding up a base one even more maybe for less money is that this one would have actual resale value lol please come to us even tho I won't buy one...unless I win the Masters of course, just waiting for my invitation!

[JNoSol]

This would be a great buy as long as they make less than 2,000 units per year. This would put it in a collector's category.

Want...

[Jay-K]

Will Us Market Get This!?

[///M3-=FiN=-]

200+ lbs is attainable. The technologies they've got, easily.

[Jim B]

I'll bet the M4 CSL (or whatever it's called) has about as much chance of being imported into the US as the Cubs have of winning the Word Series.

[solstice]

I think we can be pretty sure it will come standard with super sticky track rubber and post some eye opening ring times. If not, massive fail. This car's only mission is to be a street legal track daemon. It will be fast and it will be light and very pricey.

[M3 Number 86]

Originally Posted by Falafel Combo

A BMW is a BMW. A Porsche is a Porsche. For better or for worse, both brands have their loyalists that would pay this much and more for their respective cars. I fail to see why a potential M4 GTS immediately becomes overlooked for a GT3, merely because it happened to be in its price range. I mean, don't they at least drive different? Rear engine vs front engine, ....

The GT3 is obviously an incredible machine in its own right, with the spectacular pedigree to boot. But an M4 GTS would certainly give any performance vehicle a run for its money and would especially present a strong case when put up against any P car, GT3 or not. The truth is we just don't know anything yet about a possible M4 GTS to make any of these conclusions. For crying out loud, we don't even know what it's going to be called!

It's almost like saying "well if you optioned an M4 up to a $100k, well you may as well get a GTR".

I think the point is that for an inferior performance car the price doesn't make any sense.

I might be wrong but the other problem with dropping weight is that it is mostly going to be from the rear end making it nose heavy so at some point the balance has to make sense too right?

[Reid]

Originally Posted by Jim B

I'll bet the M4 CSL (or whatever it's called) has about as much chance of being imported into the US as the Cubs have of winning the Word Series.

[kyleb350]

Originally Posted by ///M3-=FiN=-

200+ lbs is attainable. The technologies they've got, easily.

Looking how much lighter the new 7 series is by using CF in the chassis, I'd say this is definitely possible. However, it sounds like it would mean developing practically a new car.

[ChrisMT79]

I am most excited to hear more on how the 2018 rendition will be powered. With all of the potential and obvious application of water injection (curious how they will implement knowing there are currently "packaging" issues necessitating a separate water tank), things are only getting better...

[CanAutM3]

Originally Posted by whitstap

CF hood, cf doors, cf trunk, rear seat delete, Ti exhaust, less sound deadening material, a/c delete, possibly even thinner glass if they really want...seems like they should be able to find at least 150 lbs to shave off a similar f82 dct stripper w/ccbs and get the CLS near 3300lbs or less hopefully...guess they only benefit to buying one instead of just modding up a base one even more maybe for less money is that this one would have actual resale value lol please come to us even tho I won't buy one...unless I win the Masters of course, just waiting for my invitation!

M4 already has a CF/composite trunk lid.
A CF hood will likely not be much lighter than the Aluminum one.
Aluminum doors have been mentioned.
I wonder if it will have a 48V electrical system (paired with laser/OLED) that could yield some interesting weight savings.

They will have to work quite hard to get a 200lb reduction, especially if they add a roll cage. Further, it was mentioned that the water injection system adds 22lbs.

[The long haul]

Originally Posted by Falafel Combo

A BMW is a BMW. A Porsche is a Porsche. For better or for worse, both brands have their loyalists that would pay this much and more for their respective cars. I fail to see why a potential M4 GTS immediately becomes overlooked for a GT3, merely because it happened to be in its price range. I mean, don't they at least drive different? Rear engine vs front engine, ....

The GT3 is obviously an incredible machine in its own right, with the spectacular pedigree to boot. But an M4 GTS would certainly give any performance vehicle a run for its money and would especially present a strong case when put up against any P car, GT3 or not. The truth is we just don't know anything yet about a possible M4 GTS to make any of these conclusions. For crying out loud, we don't even know what it's going to be called!

It's almost like saying "well if you optioned an M4 up to a $100k, well you may as well get a GTR".

I absolutely love the idea of a new CSL. HOWEVER if you think at the same price point as a GT3 this car would make sense, I'd have to totally disagree. Furthermore if you think the CSL/GTS F8X will even perform remotely in the same league as the GT3 you've either lost your mind or you're smoking some good shit. It'll be a great car in many ways and indifferent ways than the GT3, but it will never be as good as a GT3, period.

[nemex12]

Originally Posted by Falafel Combo

A BMW is a BMW. A Porsche is a Porsche. For better or for worse, both brands have their loyalists that would pay this much and more for their respective cars. I fail to see why a potential M4 GTS immediately becomes overlooked for a GT3, merely because it happened to be in its price range. I mean, don't they at least drive different? Rear engine vs front engine, ....

The GT3 is obviously an incredible machine in its own right, with the spectacular pedigree to boot. But an M4 GTS would certainly give any performance vehicle a run for its money and would especially present a strong case when put up against any P car, GT3 or not. The truth is we just don't know anything yet about a possible M4 GTS to make any of these conclusions. For crying out loud, we don't even know what it's going to be called!

It's almost like saying "well if you optioned an M4 up to a $100k, well you may as well get a GTR".

agreed, plus it will be a collectible a la e46 csl, so for people with money and love for the brand it would be a no brainer. it is not for the masses, it's for a selected few so there's no comparison. if you want the most bang for the buck, there's the corvette z06 but still we buy bimmers, so this would be the same. exclusivity also means big bucks

[Falafel Combo]

Originally Posted by The long haul

I absolutely love the idea of a new CSL. HOWEVER if you think at the same price point as a GT3 this car would make sense, I'd have to totally disagree. Furthermore if you think the CSL/GTS F8X will even perform remotely in the same league as the GT3 you've either lost your mind or you're smoking some good shit. It'll be a great car in many ways and indifferent ways than the GT3, but it will never be as good as a GT3, period.

I totally "get" what you are saying, but also believe it to be very close minded. We're not comparing a GT3 to a Subaru FRS here. It's an M4 GTS. But personally, I would at least wait until we know what it looks like, how light it is, get a crack at the numbers and see them side by side ... and then make some conclusions. It's just too early.

[raysspl]

I don't really care what it's called. It's the #s that matter here. Price, weight, performance, etc

[SYT_Shadow]

Originally Posted by Falafel Combo

A BMW is a BMW. A Porsche is a Porsche. For better or for worse, both brands have their loyalists that would pay this much and more for their respective cars. I fail to see why a potential M4 GTS immediately becomes overlooked for a GT3, merely because it happened to be in its price range. I mean, don't they at least drive different? Rear engine vs front engine, ....

The GT3 is obviously an incredible machine in its own right, with the spectacular pedigree to boot. But an M4 GTS would certainly give any performance vehicle a run for its money and would especially present a strong case when put up against any P car, GT3 or not. The truth is we just don't know anything yet about a possible M4 GTS to make any of these conclusions. For crying out loud, we don't even know what it's going to be called!

It's almost like saying "well if you optioned an M4 up to a $100k, well you may as well get a GTR".

Falafel

I did not mean I would buy a GT3 over this. If I came off as some kind of Porsche fanboy please excuse me, it is not the case in the very least.

There is a large demand in the BMW world for them to produce an M M car. Call it a CSL, GTS, whatever.
This is what Porsche provides with the 911, 911 S, 911 GT3, 911 GT RS: a ladder of increasing performance correlated closely with increasing price.

BMW makes special editions like the CSL or the GTS/CRT, but when they do they make them somehow limited production because they have a hand made carbon roof or they decide to build 100 units for the whole world.
This means the BMW loyalist is paying for the exclusivity, *not* performance. Yes, it is faster than the regular M car, but not as much faster as its price would indicate.

This approach is lost on me completely. The BMW loyalist who is not trying to buy a car for a museum but actually wants an M product of superior performance than a plane jane M car is screwed.

You want a more track ready machine than an M? BMW won't sell it to you. You are literally forced to move to Porsche if you want something made for the track.

Now it seems like BMW will build us another CSL/GTS whatever. And I hear foolishness of OLED rear lights, laser front lights, blah blah blah -- where the hell is the performance? They should spend the money on carbon doors to reduce weight, additional horses and making a special interior.

Imagine how ridiculous it would be to be in a Porsche dealership and have this conversation
Salesman: here is this nice 911 S we have for $110k
Me: Nice, but I compete for the HDPE trophy and I want something faster. What do you have that is track ready?
Salesman: Well we have this special 911 CSL. It has a few more horses than the 911 S, but it has laser lights! and oled rear lights!!
Me: Hmm not really sure that's what I'm looking for. What is the price tag?
Salesman: $220k. Porsche decided they would build 3 cars, and those laser lights are dope!!

Well that is what I'm getting at. The E46 CSL was faster than the equivalent Ferrari and GT3 of the era. The GTS was clearly not, but BMW built 100 so they couldn't distribute production costs and it was expensive as hell.
Now the new GTS/CSL is under discussion and it looks like it will go the way of the last special edition instead of a car that is actually faster than the competition.

Meanwhile, the people who want track-ready cars are left with no choice but Porsche.

BMW should build a true 'competition package' that is $20k and significantly increases performance. But hey, don't listen to an internet fanboy, just look at how successful Porsche has been with this strategy.

First, BMW should satisfy the massive contingent of people who want a higher performance M car. Then, if there's extra time, they should take care of the hard parkers and collectors.