530E 2017 wobbling at idle and in drive

CnSky · 03-07-2021, 01:59 PM

Thanks to everyone who has provided help on my other posting. This issue is driving me mad and sorry in advance for the long post, this is a weird problem.

New to me since 26th Dec 530E 2017 M sport with VDC, 20-inch alloys and 50K KM on the clock.

The car had some shaking and wobbling issues when I bought it. It is just out of warranty at BMW but the seller has a 6-month warranty which I’m still inside of to June but cannot ID the issue so getting it fixed is proving a problem. (Car was owned by BMW UK before me as a rep’s car)
The issue is two parts, but I feel the dame underlying issue is causing them.

1. when parked with the engine in gear and on the car wobbles randomly. This is not engine vibration it randomly feels as though the car has gone over a small bump. The shake seems to be coming from the engine when its running and feels more pronounced in the rear of the car. This is the same effect you get when revving in neutral the engine shakes, but the feeling is that the back of the car is shaking so the movement is clearly transferring down the body via the transmission and drive shaft. I can imagine its increased when driving and is likely the source of my item 2 below. When looking at the engine there is normal vibration, but I cannot see any random shakes occurring so perhaps it is the gearbox mount that gone or Guibo/CSB. (Or maybe a coil or spark plug causing rough idle as I also noticed the exhaust tips are covered in soot again very quickly after being cleaned only last week)

2. When driving the wobble is always randomly occurring and becomes more pronounced when banking left on a motorway and is noticeable when braking on a curve for example existing a motorway while banking left also. It also gets into a rhythm sometimes and can feel much worse on perfect surfaces. It is very noticeable on good surfaces or at standstill as above, but I can feel it in the background always even on rough surfaces. On the motorway or perfect surfaces, it is like I am driving randomly over small imperfections in the road or lots of small undulating ripples. I even checked this on a new surfaced carpark. Also, it is there if I am in Edrive also so even with the engine off I get wobble which seems to maybe indicate the Gearbox mount/Guibo/CSB and not coil or plugs.

Have been to BMW but they cannot diagnose or replicate the issue probably because they will not let me drive with them due COVID, wont drive on a motorway and are not the best regards maintenance issues in my opinion. I am an aircraft mechanic myself, so their fault-finding techniques leave a bit to be desired IMHO.

Car drives fine no handling issues etc. The general random wobbling puts me off though and means im not confident in its ability. Only weird noises I sometimes get is a slight kick when changing to reverse to drive out of my house when cold and a slight groan when I then move the steering while reversing out of the driveway. Car is parked on a nose down incline, so I put it down to that.

To date I have.
• Change all brakes and discs at BMW which solved a shake I had under braking (they were run out)
• All alloys refurbished at a well know company and a buckle taken out of the rear left.
• Changed the old RE50 RFT to non RFT which made the car much smoother bit did not solve the wobbling/shaking.
• Full alignment and balancing at both BMW and an Indy no change. (Indy did a better job)
• BMW and INDY checked all suspension parts and have identified no issued anywhere.
• Full iStep update to latest version.
• NO fault codes when checked at BMW and INDY.

After talking to forum members…
• All 530E have soft mounts and smaller ARBs at the rear with VDC so the car shakes a lot if you start the engine in park and rev it so this seems normal. (possibly due to the strop start nature of the car engine) but should harden up when driving and vacuum comes on.
• I tried to check the vacuum connections and test it but without a lift its impossible and my borescope couldn’t get to the bottom side of the mounts.
• Have tested in all different drive modes etc. and no change E drive, Eco Pro, Comfort, Sport all the same.

I plan to do the following but would appreciate comments or advice…
• Road force balance due tomorrow just want to be 1000% sure the wheels/tires don’t have an issue, but two dealers and Indy have checked them already without any problems noted.
• Guibo and two new rear stabilizer arms going in Tuesday with new alignment and will inspect the drive shaft for play, Gearbox mount, engine mounts and CSB for wear and correct vacuum connections.
• Have the indy check vacuum system by disconnecting and driving to see if it worse, if it is not then probably the issue in a solenoid or disconnect hose somewhere and mounts are not firming up in drive but does not explain the shake at park/idle. They will so do a vacuum check the normal way.

I’m starting to think it the gearbox mount/Guibo/CSB as it seems that is linked to both Edrive and engine drive. I have never experienced a gear box mount fail before on any car can anyone chime in on what symptoms you get from that (shaking/wobbling drivetrain?). The 530E probably places a lot of stress on that part due to regen braking and it could explain the whole issue

Really want to keep the car as it has literally every option apart from rear entertainment and upgraded sound system, which is very rare in Ireland, but it is ruined by this wobbling shaking issue.

Not against putting more money into the problem but need to know it is a solution before wasting it on random stuff.

Help Ideas and advice much appreiacted

f30modern · 03-07-2021, 02:21 PM

I think I would try to take it to the dealership and then get some stock tires and wheels on the car to see if that could help with the wobble. The part where the random wobble parts is confusing me. Wish I could be more helpful but that's what I would do.

CnSky · 03-07-2021, 02:40 PM

Thank F30 have been there twice they said no faults on computer and they can't feel it but my Indy and a few friends agree something is wrong but we haven't yet dropped the under side covers to investigate due COVID restrictions.

Issue is dealers are somewhat useless these days if the computer shows nothing and a drive around the lot causes no issues they say no fault.

Asked them twice to let me come in the drive, drive on motorway and can I talk to the mechanic but no joy on both occasions. Think maybe a different dealer could be my next option.

I'm pretty sure the wheels are not the issue I get that the 20 inch alloys with low profile tyres will feel more road feedback and have experienced this in high performance cars but this random wobble is nothing to do with the road as happens even in park and on fresh laid perfect tarmac.

HighlandPete · 03-07-2021, 02:41 PM

I've read through all your posts on this subject and I'm a bit confused.

For example, you mention road force balancing... you have this vibration and the feel of going over a bump when stationary? Why are you looking at wheel issues?

Am I missing something vital, as if you are stationary with this issue, what makes you think of anything non rotating, rear of the gearbox, possibly inducing this wobble.

Have you listened to the exhaust, to see is there is a partial misfire when stationary and idling in gear? Does it shake when idling out of gear?

If you really suspect the engine moving too much, I'd be making some movement checks, set up some tear tags, to give you the amount of movement, when driving. Get some data.

Mileage seems too low for major wear issues, has it had a hard life?

HighlandPete · 03-07-2021, 02:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CnSky

I'm pretty sure the wheels are not the issue I get that the 20 inch alloys with low profile tyres will feel more road feedback and have experienced this in high performance cars but this random wobble is nothing to do with the road as happens even in park and on fresh laid perfect tarmac.

Not much rotating in Park... I'd be back to how smooth the idle. Is the engine stumbling, even if no discernible misfire?

CnSky · 03-07-2021, 02:59 PM

Thanks highland.

I'm doing the road force tomorrow just to be 100% sure that the previous buckle was removed properly and to remove wheels from the equation once and for all.

I'm pretty sure it's not the wheels as I can feel normal road feedback and the wheels and tyres are refurbished and new but for 100 euro it a cheap item to start with.

I like the idea of tear tags never thought of that.

I actually plan to setup my go pro under the car in the transmission tunnel when the covers are off this Tuesday and drive around so I can see any movement on my phone and record it, will share that on this thread.

We will also fit rear stab arms and a new Guibo that day but my gut feeling is that an engine or the gear box mount is shot or badly worn (not receiving any vacuum) and allowing the engine, transmission and drive shaft to move too much.

This would also be an issue also when in edrive and im feeling it most when the motor/engine is asked for power or when I come off power and regen starts

The wobble is in the car body not from a corner or via the steering wheel and car is acting normal when driving. I guess a ton of metal shaking too much would cause that sensation and may be made worse by VDC and the smaller 18mm ARB.

All vibrations seem to move to the rear from my experiment when revving at standstill and this makes it even more upsetting as it feel alike the car is unstable even though it is.

CnSky · 03-07-2021, 03:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by HighlandPete

Quote:

Originally Posted by CnSky

I'm pretty sure the wheels are not the issue I get that the 20 inch alloys with low profile tyres will feel more road feedback and have experienced this in high performance cars but this random wobble is nothing to do with the road as happens even in park and on fresh laid perfect tarmac.

Not much rotating in Park... I'd be back to how smooth the idle. Is the engine stumbling, even if no discernible misfire?

That is a really good point and I had thought it through but open to more input.

My view was...

If there is no rotation in park with engine on but the shake is happening it could be a misfire or coil issue but the engine is not exhibiting any symptoms apart from some black build up on the exhaust tips that seems to have come back very quickly.

So I though as the engine is running and from my revving test it kicks to the right on those soft mounts very easily when in park so if the mounts(engine or gearbox) are bad then it could be twisting slightly as it idles back and forth randomly when cold.

The wobble in park feels like a softer version of the wobble I get when I rev the engine.

QUOTE=HighlandPete;27314158]

Quote:

Originally Posted by CnSky

I'm pretty sure the wheels are not the issue I get that the 20 inch alloys with low profile tyres will feel more road feedback and have experienced this in high performance cars but this random wobble is nothing to do with the road as happens even in park and on fresh laid perfect tarmac.

Not much rotating in Park... I'd be back to how smooth the idle. Is the engine stumbling, even if no discernible misfire?[/QUOTE]

HighlandPete · 03-07-2021, 03:10 PM

I was going to suggest trying a camera if you could set it up safely. The feeling on and off load, I'd be suspect of the gearbox end moving about.

Does chassis 'sport' mode make a difference to the feel? I would suggest it might, as the firmer damping (in a bend) slows the body weight transfer.

HighlandPete · 03-07-2021, 03:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CnSky

My view was...

If there is no rotation in park with engine on but the shake is happening it could be a misfire or coil issue but the engine is not exhibiting any symptoms apart from some black build up on the exhaust tips that seems to have come back very quickly.

Problem with DI engines, exhausts black very quickly and don't clean even with harder use. Keep it in mind, but don't get too concerned unless there are other signs of an engine smooth running issue.

CnSky · 03-07-2021, 03:19 PM

Highland to add

the exhaust sound fine no misfires I can identify rev counter is solid at 1000 rpm and no noises from the exhaust and engine bay.

Wobble feeling at park is the same in or out of gear I just went out and started in neutral and it's wobbling.

Car is pristine so think it has had a good life with BMW UK as it's previous owner although I noted the second service was over due by 3000km but as it's a reps car that was probably a week of driving.

It amazes me how much the car shakes at park when revved but per other members on here it's normal but I will be in another identical 530e tomorrow so will check.

CnSky · 03-07-2021, 03:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by HighlandPete

I was going to suggest trying a camera if you could set it up safely. The feeling on and off load, I'd be suspect of the gearbox end moving about.

Does chassis 'sport' mode make a difference to the feel? I would suggest it might, as the firmer damping (in a bend) slows the body weight transfer.

Sport makes no difference at all.

I tend to agree probably the gearbox moving around and causing the block and drive shaft to shake.

Worried it has also damaged the Guibo and CSB.

QUOTE=HighlandPete;27314251]I was going to suggest trying a camera if you could set it up safely. The feeling on and off load, I'd be suspect of the gearbox end moving about.

Does chassis 'sport' mode make a difference to the feel? I would suggest it might, as the firmer damping (in a bend) slows the body weight transfer.[/QUOTE]

HighlandPete · 03-07-2021, 03:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CnSky

It amazes me how much the car shakes at park when revved but per other members on here it's normal but I will be in another identical 530e tomorrow so will check.

That's a good move, nothing like a direct comparison.

CnSky · 03-07-2021, 04:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by HighlandPete

Quote:

Originally Posted by CnSky

It amazes me how much the car shakes at park when revved but per other members on here it's normal but I will be in another identical 530e tomorrow so will check.

That's a good move, nothing like a direct comparison.

Thanks for your advise will keep it in mind while trying to sort this out this week.

Fingers crossed.

CnSky · 03-08-2021, 11:30 AM

So I drove another similar spec 530e today and it didn't have this wobble or unstable feeling on any surfaces.

I can confirm engine does move a huge amount when revving in park so that's not an indication of bad engine or vaccum. Could still be a gearbox mount I guess.

I got annoyed and when I got home setup my gopro on each corner looking in toward the suspension etc and went for a few drives. I think I'm noticing excessive rear subframe movement when accelerating and braking, the entire frame moves a lot back and forth up and down and then settles in a new position until I next accelerate or brake. This seems very abnormal to me I would expect the frame to return to a neutral position each time. Could explain everything I'm feeling I guess/instability and wobbling.

I will post videos later tonight and see what people think. Normal or not.

Also plan another drive tomorrow looking in above the rear subframe so I can get a better overall idea as opposed to what I can see from each corner.

Anyone know how big a job it is to change the subframe mounts.

LogicalApex · 03-08-2021, 12:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CnSky

So I drove another similar spec 530e today and it didn't have this wobble or unstable feeling on any surfaces.

I can confirm engine does move a huge amount when revving in park so that's not an indication of bad engine or vaccum. Could still be a gearbox mount I guess.

I got annoyed and when I got home setup my gopro on each corner looking in toward the suspicion etc and went for a few drives. I think I'm noticing excessive rear subframe movement when accelerating and braking, the entire frame moves a lot back and forth up and down and then settles in a new position until I next accelerate or brake. This seems very abnormal to me I would expect the frame to return to a neutral position each time. Could explain everything I'm feeling I guess/instability and wobbling.

I will post videos later tonight and see what people think. Normal or not.

Also plan another drive tomorrow looking in above the rear subframe so I can get a better overall idea as opposed to what I can see from each corner.

Anyone know how big a job it is to change the subframe mounts.

Looking forward to your video to better understand the issue.

CnSky · 03-08-2021, 02:40 PM

Videos available below please come back if you see anything strange.

I feel the back Left damper may be damaged seems that side vibrates a lot more than the other side and that wheel did have a large buckle when i got it refurbished...but could be just because im driving on right hand side here in Ireland. A dodgy VDC damper could it cause the instability feeling and wobble when driving and at park.

Road force done today and the rears were off a little but nothing major, the operator said that the wheels were perfectly round no buckles, he also moved the tyres on the wheel to the best poistion etc. All weight in total are below 20 Grams front both at 12g.

Didnt post front videos as they seems to show no issues, nothing of interest at all and are not well lit.

Back right... at 06:10 I go onto a surface that causes the wobble to be more pronounced (although its always there) and seems to me the subframe moves a lot when coming on and of accelerator, note I rarely brake in these videos except for stopping and turning

Back Left...at 08:22 I go onto the same surface that causes the wobble to be more pronounced and seem to me the subframe moves a lot when coming on and of accelerator and stopping.

Tomorroe im changing the two rear stab arms although only doing it as i have the parts and new bolts and the Guibo at same time. Not sure it will make any difference.

Im tempted to change the back left shock now as I sometimes think the wobble is coming from there but its very hard to be sure.

HighlandPete · 03-08-2021, 02:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LogicalApex

Looking forward to your video to better understand the issue.

Same here.

Description appears to suggest at least a couple of the mounts are torn and moving around in the outer 'jacket'.

The nearest experience I've encountered, was in my E39 Touring. The rear subframe mounts on the touring were hydro-bushes, which had lost the fluid. The rear became what I can only describe as "jelly like", over smaller ripples in the road.

I didn't really realise how bad the rear movement had become, until the mounts were replaced. Besides the rear not being jittery over bumps anymore, the first overtake and lane change, wow, there was directional precision again. Yes, the rear had started floating about, but more subtle than the OP is experiencing.

Let's hope we see some clearly failing components.

CnSky · 03-08-2021, 03:40 PM

Think you will be disappointed by above doesn't seem that bad but I'm no pro on just how much a sub frame should move.

Fact it's not moving laterally doesn't seem to indicate its causing my wobbling.

I just went for a drive and checked tyre pressure it was good but decided to mark the car as fully loaded for a reset and it's has improved the drive over rough surfaces or so it seems.

On smooth good surfaces I'm still getting the wobble feeling.

Frustrating!!!

CnSky · 03-08-2021, 03:41 PM

I'm hoping that the Guibo and CSB look crap tomorrow and that explains everything.. well except for the small wobbling in park at idle.

HighlandPete · 03-09-2021, 04:01 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CnSky

Think you will be disappointed by above doesn't seem that bad but I'm no pro on just how much a sub frame should move.

Fact it's not moving laterally doesn't seem to indicate its causing my wobbling.

Appears pretty tight to me. Yes there is a bit of movement when getting extra load, but we'd expect some movement. Its certainly not floating around to fit the feeling you are sensing.

Doesn't appear to be any strange damping action on the near side, to my eyes.

CnSky · 03-09-2021, 06:14 AM

Going to take all of the lower engine covers off today and records the drive shaft and transmission movement when driving will see how that looks when moving.

CnSky · 03-09-2021, 12:12 PM

Update:

After a few hours in the local Indy garage and two test drives think we found the issue although open to everyone advice. Just how soft should a gearbox mount be in a 530E?

We took a test drive, and the mechanic agrees there is shaking wobbling from the floor of the car not from front or back, seems centered and it gets worse at speed when accelerating and coming off accelerator (so I’m not going mad)

We checked all suspension parts and shocks with pry bars and noted nothing out of the ordinary or that was not the same softness/hardness on both sides.

We took off lower covers and checked engine mounts and underbody noting no leaks or damage, so we decided to disconnect the engine mount vacuum and go for a drive. it made no difference at all to how the car drove, so we thought maybe the mounts are staying soft or no vacuum from solenoid.

We hooked up a vacuum gauge and noted that at idle the vacuum is on (first picture below) but when you rev it goes to zero (second picture below) so seems the vacuum system is either...working wrong way around (what do you all think is this normal) or the mounts are in hard mode as standard with no vacuum applied and go soft when it is applied... so at idle they are in soft mode by way of the Vacuum. See photos.

Still seems to me the mounts are super soft even when vacuum is not applied when revving as the car shakes a ton when revved in neutral but that seems normal from the other cars I tested, and everyones feedback on the forum.

We checked Guibo/flex disc it looks brand new not a mark or any corosion. We didnt check CSB as access requries removing exhaust but if the below gearbox mount isnt the issue it my last option. We coudnt even see it with a torch etc behind the heat shields its very far back.

Finally, we focused on the gear box mount and to our surprise its super soft in fact it’s super easy to move with a small 1 ft pry bar, It would amaze us it’s not shot so we feel this is the issue, but no one has worked on a G30 mount before. See video links below. It looks ok visually no damage or tears but is this normal movement/softness? Could there be broken bolts in it? we did not note anything visually but never took the cross member off.

The rubber looks like its fluid filled or its super super soft. The entire transmisson and exhaust shakes very easily and this is one of the feeling I have as though a weight is shifting in corners etc

Hope this is the problem as its super cheap and easy to fix.

03-07-2021, 01:59 PM	#1
CnSky Major 330 Rep 1,028 Posts Drives: BMW 530E 2017 Join Date: Aug 2013 Location: Ireland iTrader: (0)	530E 2017 wobbling at idle and in drive Thanks to everyone who has provided help on my other posting. This issue is driving me mad and sorry in advance for the long post, this is a weird problem. New to me since 26th Dec 530E 2017 M sport with VDC, 20-inch alloys and 50K KM on the clock. The car had some shaking and wobbling issues when I bought it. It is just out of warranty at BMW but the seller has a 6-month warranty which I’m still inside of to June but cannot ID the issue so getting it fixed is proving a problem. (Car was owned by BMW UK before me as a rep’s car) The issue is two parts, but I feel the dame underlying issue is causing them. 1. when parked with the engine in gear and on the car wobbles randomly. This is not engine vibration it randomly feels as though the car has gone over a small bump. The shake seems to be coming from the engine when its running and feels more pronounced in the rear of the car. This is the same effect you get when revving in neutral the engine shakes, but the feeling is that the back of the car is shaking so the movement is clearly transferring down the body via the transmission and drive shaft. I can imagine its increased when driving and is likely the source of my item 2 below. When looking at the engine there is normal vibration, but I cannot see any random shakes occurring so perhaps it is the gearbox mount that gone or Guibo/CSB. (Or maybe a coil or spark plug causing rough idle as I also noticed the exhaust tips are covered in soot again very quickly after being cleaned only last week) 2. When driving the wobble is always randomly occurring and becomes more pronounced when banking left on a motorway and is noticeable when braking on a curve for example existing a motorway while banking left also. It also gets into a rhythm sometimes and can feel much worse on perfect surfaces. It is very noticeable on good surfaces or at standstill as above, but I can feel it in the background always even on rough surfaces. On the motorway or perfect surfaces, it is like I am driving randomly over small imperfections in the road or lots of small undulating ripples. I even checked this on a new surfaced carpark. Also, it is there if I am in Edrive also so even with the engine off I get wobble which seems to maybe indicate the Gearbox mount/Guibo/CSB and not coil or plugs. Have been to BMW but they cannot diagnose or replicate the issue probably because they will not let me drive with them due COVID, wont drive on a motorway and are not the best regards maintenance issues in my opinion. I am an aircraft mechanic myself, so their fault-finding techniques leave a bit to be desired IMHO. Car drives fine no handling issues etc. The general random wobbling puts me off though and means im not confident in its ability. Only weird noises I sometimes get is a slight kick when changing to reverse to drive out of my house when cold and a slight groan when I then move the steering while reversing out of the driveway. Car is parked on a nose down incline, so I put it down to that. To date I have. • Change all brakes and discs at BMW which solved a shake I had under braking (they were run out) • All alloys refurbished at a well know company and a buckle taken out of the rear left. • Changed the old RE50 RFT to non RFT which made the car much smoother bit did not solve the wobbling/shaking. • Full alignment and balancing at both BMW and an Indy no change. (Indy did a better job) • BMW and INDY checked all suspension parts and have identified no issued anywhere. • Full iStep update to latest version. • NO fault codes when checked at BMW and INDY. After talking to forum members… • All 530E have soft mounts and smaller ARBs at the rear with VDC so the car shakes a lot if you start the engine in park and rev it so this seems normal. (possibly due to the strop start nature of the car engine) but should harden up when driving and vacuum comes on. • I tried to check the vacuum connections and test it but without a lift its impossible and my borescope couldn’t get to the bottom side of the mounts. • Have tested in all different drive modes etc. and no change E drive, Eco Pro, Comfort, Sport all the same. I plan to do the following but would appreciate comments or advice… • Road force balance due tomorrow just want to be 1000% sure the wheels/tires don’t have an issue, but two dealers and Indy have checked them already without any problems noted. • Guibo and two new rear stabilizer arms going in Tuesday with new alignment and will inspect the drive shaft for play, Gearbox mount, engine mounts and CSB for wear and correct vacuum connections. • Have the indy check vacuum system by disconnecting and driving to see if it worse, if it is not then probably the issue in a solenoid or disconnect hose somewhere and mounts are not firming up in drive but does not explain the shake at park/idle. They will so do a vacuum check the normal way. I’m starting to think it the gearbox mount/Guibo/CSB as it seems that is linked to both Edrive and engine drive. I have never experienced a gear box mount fail before on any car can anyone chime in on what symptoms you get from that (shaking/wobbling drivetrain?). The 530E probably places a lot of stress on that part due to regen braking and it could explain the whole issue Really want to keep the car as it has literally every option apart from rear entertainment and upgraded sound system, which is very rare in Ireland, but it is ruined by this wobbling shaking issue. Not against putting more money into the problem but need to know it is a solution before wasting it on random stuff. Help Ideas and advice much appreiacted
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03-07-2021, 02:21 PM	#2
f30modern Private First Class 56 Rep 151 Posts Drives: 2017 540i M sport Join Date: Oct 2017 Location: Virginia iTrader: (0) Garage List 2012 BMW 328i [0.00]	I think I would try to take it to the dealership and then get some stock tires and wheels on the car to see if that could help with the wobble. The part where the random wobble parts is confusing me. Wish I could be more helpful but that's what I would do.
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03-07-2021, 02:40 PM	#3
CnSky Major 330 Rep 1,028 Posts Drives: BMW 530E 2017 Join Date: Aug 2013 Location: Ireland iTrader: (0)	Thank F30 have been there twice they said no faults on computer and they can't feel it but my Indy and a few friends agree something is wrong but we haven't yet dropped the under side covers to investigate due COVID restrictions. Issue is dealers are somewhat useless these days if the computer shows nothing and a drive around the lot causes no issues they say no fault. Asked them twice to let me come in the drive, drive on motorway and can I talk to the mechanic but no joy on both occasions. Think maybe a different dealer could be my next option. I'm pretty sure the wheels are not the issue I get that the 20 inch alloys with low profile tyres will feel more road feedback and have experienced this in high performance cars but this random wobble is nothing to do with the road as happens even in park and on fresh laid perfect tarmac.
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03-07-2021, 02:41 PM	#4
HighlandPete Lieutenant General 6659 Rep 15,858 Posts Drives: BMW F11 535i Touring Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Scotland, Highland Region iTrader: (0)	I've read through all your posts on this subject and I'm a bit confused. For example, you mention road force balancing... you have this vibration and the feel of going over a bump when stationary? Why are you looking at wheel issues? Am I missing something vital, as if you are stationary with this issue, what makes you think of anything non rotating, rear of the gearbox, possibly inducing this wobble. Have you listened to the exhaust, to see is there is a partial misfire when stationary and idling in gear? Does it shake when idling out of gear? If you really suspect the engine moving too much, I'd be making some movement checks, set up some tear tags, to give you the amount of movement, when driving. Get some data. Mileage seems too low for major wear issues, has it had a hard life?
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03-07-2021, 02:59 PM	#6
CnSky Major 330 Rep 1,028 Posts Drives: BMW 530E 2017 Join Date: Aug 2013 Location: Ireland iTrader: (0)	Thanks highland. I'm doing the road force tomorrow just to be 100% sure that the previous buckle was removed properly and to remove wheels from the equation once and for all. I'm pretty sure it's not the wheels as I can feel normal road feedback and the wheels and tyres are refurbished and new but for 100 euro it a cheap item to start with. I like the idea of tear tags never thought of that. I actually plan to setup my go pro under the car in the transmission tunnel when the covers are off this Tuesday and drive around so I can see any movement on my phone and record it, will share that on this thread. We will also fit rear stab arms and a new Guibo that day but my gut feeling is that an engine or the gear box mount is shot or badly worn (not receiving any vacuum) and allowing the engine, transmission and drive shaft to move too much. This would also be an issue also when in edrive and im feeling it most when the motor/engine is asked for power or when I come off power and regen starts The wobble is in the car body not from a corner or via the steering wheel and car is acting normal when driving. I guess a ton of metal shaking too much would cause that sensation and may be made worse by VDC and the smaller 18mm ARB. All vibrations seem to move to the rear from my experiment when revving at standstill and this makes it even more upsetting as it feel alike the car is unstable even though it is.
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03-07-2021, 03:10 PM	#8
HighlandPete Lieutenant General 6659 Rep 15,858 Posts Drives: BMW F11 535i Touring Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Scotland, Highland Region iTrader: (0)	I was going to suggest trying a camera if you could set it up safely. The feeling on and off load, I'd be suspect of the gearbox end moving about. Does chassis 'sport' mode make a difference to the feel? I would suggest it might, as the firmer damping (in a bend) slows the body weight transfer.
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03-07-2021, 03:19 PM	#10
CnSky Major 330 Rep 1,028 Posts Drives: BMW 530E 2017 Join Date: Aug 2013 Location: Ireland iTrader: (0)	Highland to add the exhaust sound fine no misfires I can identify rev counter is solid at 1000 rpm and no noises from the exhaust and engine bay. Wobble feeling at park is the same in or out of gear I just went out and started in neutral and it's wobbling. Car is pristine so think it has had a good life with BMW UK as it's previous owner although I noted the second service was over due by 3000km but as it's a reps car that was probably a week of driving. It amazes me how much the car shakes at park when revved but per other members on here it's normal but I will be in another identical 530e tomorrow so will check.
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03-08-2021, 11:30 AM	#14
CnSky Major 330 Rep 1,028 Posts Drives: BMW 530E 2017 Join Date: Aug 2013 Location: Ireland iTrader: (0)	So I drove another similar spec 530e today and it didn't have this wobble or unstable feeling on any surfaces. I can confirm engine does move a huge amount when revving in park so that's not an indication of bad engine or vaccum. Could still be a gearbox mount I guess. I got annoyed and when I got home setup my gopro on each corner looking in toward the suspension etc and went for a few drives. I think I'm noticing excessive rear subframe movement when accelerating and braking, the entire frame moves a lot back and forth up and down and then settles in a new position until I next accelerate or brake. This seems very abnormal to me I would expect the frame to return to a neutral position each time. Could explain everything I'm feeling I guess/instability and wobbling. I will post videos later tonight and see what people think. Normal or not. Also plan another drive tomorrow looking in above the rear subframe so I can get a better overall idea as opposed to what I can see from each corner. Anyone know how big a job it is to change the subframe mounts. Last edited by CnSky; 03-09-2021 at 03:46 PM..
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03-08-2021, 02:40 PM	#16
CnSky Major 330 Rep 1,028 Posts Drives: BMW 530E 2017 Join Date: Aug 2013 Location: Ireland iTrader: (0)	Videos available below please come back if you see anything strange. I feel the back Left damper may be damaged seems that side vibrates a lot more than the other side and that wheel did have a large buckle when i got it refurbished...but could be just because im driving on right hand side here in Ireland. A dodgy VDC damper could it cause the instability feeling and wobble when driving and at park. Road force done today and the rears were off a little but nothing major, the operator said that the wheels were perfectly round no buckles, he also moved the tyres on the wheel to the best poistion etc. All weight in total are below 20 Grams front both at 12g. Didnt post front videos as they seems to show no issues, nothing of interest at all and are not well lit. Back right... at 06:10 I go onto a surface that causes the wobble to be more pronounced (although its always there) and seems to me the subframe moves a lot when coming on and of accelerator, note I rarely brake in these videos except for stopping and turning Back Left...at 08:22 I go onto the same surface that causes the wobble to be more pronounced and seem to me the subframe moves a lot when coming on and of accelerator and stopping. Tomorroe im changing the two rear stab arms although only doing it as i have the parts and new bolts and the Guibo at same time. Not sure it will make any difference. Im tempted to change the back left shock now as I sometimes think the wobble is coming from there but its very hard to be sure.
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03-08-2021, 03:40 PM	#18
CnSky Major 330 Rep 1,028 Posts Drives: BMW 530E 2017 Join Date: Aug 2013 Location: Ireland iTrader: (0)	Think you will be disappointed by above doesn't seem that bad but I'm no pro on just how much a sub frame should move. Fact it's not moving laterally doesn't seem to indicate its causing my wobbling. I just went for a drive and checked tyre pressure it was good but decided to mark the car as fully loaded for a reset and it's has improved the drive over rough surfaces or so it seems. On smooth good surfaces I'm still getting the wobble feeling. Frustrating!!! Last edited by CnSky; 03-09-2021 at 03:47 PM..
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03-08-2021, 03:41 PM	#19
CnSky Major 330 Rep 1,028 Posts Drives: BMW 530E 2017 Join Date: Aug 2013 Location: Ireland iTrader: (0)	I'm hoping that the Guibo and CSB look crap tomorrow and that explains everything.. well except for the small wobbling in park at idle.
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03-09-2021, 06:14 AM	#21
CnSky Major 330 Rep 1,028 Posts Drives: BMW 530E 2017 Join Date: Aug 2013 Location: Ireland iTrader: (0)	Going to take all of the lower engine covers off today and records the drive shaft and transmission movement when driving will see how that looks when moving.
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03-09-2021, 12:12 PM	#22
CnSky Major 330 Rep 1,028 Posts Drives: BMW 530E 2017 Join Date: Aug 2013 Location: Ireland iTrader: (0)	Update: After a few hours in the local Indy garage and two test drives think we found the issue although open to everyone advice. Just how soft should a gearbox mount be in a 530E? We took a test drive, and the mechanic agrees there is shaking wobbling from the floor of the car not from front or back, seems centered and it gets worse at speed when accelerating and coming off accelerator (so I’m not going mad) We checked all suspension parts and shocks with pry bars and noted nothing out of the ordinary or that was not the same softness/hardness on both sides. We took off lower covers and checked engine mounts and underbody noting no leaks or damage, so we decided to disconnect the engine mount vacuum and go for a drive. it made no difference at all to how the car drove, so we thought maybe the mounts are staying soft or no vacuum from solenoid. We hooked up a vacuum gauge and noted that at idle the vacuum is on (first picture below) but when you rev it goes to zero (second picture below) so seems the vacuum system is either...working wrong way around (what do you all think is this normal) or the mounts are in hard mode as standard with no vacuum applied and go soft when it is applied... so at idle they are in soft mode by way of the Vacuum. See photos. Still seems to me the mounts are super soft even when vacuum is not applied when revving as the car shakes a ton when revved in neutral but that seems normal from the other cars I tested, and everyones feedback on the forum. We checked Guibo/flex disc it looks brand new not a mark or any corosion. We didnt check CSB as access requries removing exhaust but if the below gearbox mount isnt the issue it my last option. We coudnt even see it with a torch etc behind the heat shields its very far back. Finally, we focused on the gear box mount and to our surprise its super soft in fact it’s super easy to move with a small 1 ft pry bar, It would amaze us it’s not shot so we feel this is the issue, but no one has worked on a G30 mount before. See video links below. It looks ok visually no damage or tears but is this normal movement/softness? Could there be broken bolts in it? we did not note anything visually but never took the cross member off. The rubber looks like its fluid filled or its super super soft. The entire transmisson and exhaust shakes very easily and this is one of the feeling I have as though a weight is shifting in corners etc Hope this is the problem as its super cheap and easy to fix. Attached Images Last edited by CnSky; 03-09-2021 at 03:51 PM..
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