[clbmw]

Sorry but all the comments about M being diluted don't make sense. M has been as diluted as a homeopathic remedy for decades.

I've posted this before a few years ago but I remember being a kid and looking over an e36 with the little M logo all over it (on the wheels, gear lever etc) and not understanding that it wasn't an M3 (?!) obviously it's M sport - I understood that as I got older and realised it's just a trim level.

M performance logically is less diluted being a step closer to the real M (although admittedly still very different and much more like the standard car). Having said that I think BMW should do themselves a favour and make adaptive dampers standard on M Performance models (just build it into the price).

[Ghostriderf80]

Originally Posted by M3 Adjuster

Badass, and still classy too.

Its because Americans like big displacement and simple cars.

[54Me]

Reality Check...
Anyone who cares, knows a real M when they see it.
Anyone who cares, knows that M-Sport is not a real M.
Anyone who doesn't know...doesn't care.
Why could you possibly care what badge is on a car you don't own?
You know what you drive. You feel what you drive. You know the difference of what you drive, because just maybe you had to drive something once, way back before you became the "Keeper of the M badge", that people like you are now would classify as "wannabe" and "poser"...
If you have always been an M guy, and have zero empathy for people enjoying somewhat improved performance, better looks, and/or the misguided status of an obvious M-sport badge... congrats!... but don't continue to believe the little M on the fender of a cheaper car should devalue your own personal experience and stature... that's just sad.
Believe it or not nobody else gives a shit about your car but you (yes, even those on this site that say "congrats, nice car"), but some do strive to reach your level of success. If you can't value your internationally coveted $100K+ car because you believe your badge has been devalued by the peons then maybe you should start valuing something else in your life.
Cheers.

P.S. If I am kicked off thank you all for the mostly inspiring but sometimes eye-popping commentary on this site... can't wait to get my "M-killer" in a few days

[Paul-Bracq-BMW]

Originally Posted by 54Me

Reality Check...
Anyone who cares, knows a real M when they see it.
Anyone who cares, knows that M-Sport is not a real M.
Anyone who doesn't know...doesn't care.
Why could you possibly care what badge is on a car you don't own?
You know what you drive. You feel what you drive. You know the difference of what you drive, because just maybe you had to drive something once, way back before you became the "Keeper of the M badge", that people like you are now would classify as "wannabe" and "poser"...
If you have always been an M guy, and have zero empathy for people enjoying somewhat improved performance, better looks, and/or the misguided status of an obvious M-sport badge... congrats!... but don't continue to believe the little M on the fender of a cheaper car should devalue your own personal experience and stature... that's just sad.
Believe it or not nobody else gives a shit about your car but you (yes, even those on this site that say "congrats, nice car"), but some do strive to reach your level of success. If you can't value your internationally coveted $100K+ car because you believe your badge has been devalued by the peons then maybe you should start valuing something else in your life.
Cheers.

P.S. If I am kicked off thank you all for the mostly inspiring but sometimes eye-popping commentary on this site... can't wait to get my "M-killer" in a few days

I Think the debate about a real M and the M Performance is old...

As far as I've experienced the BMW brand, that since the early eighties, there always was an hardcore M car (starting from the M5) and regular BMW cars with M bits. They either had an M badge added next to their regular denominations or they were called "is". They were in philosophy exactly like the M Performance of today, improved over the regular models but not as hardcore as the M cars. In fact the "is" models of yesteryear were more targeted to the driving enthusiasts than today's M Performance models because they often came with an LSD and a close ratio gearbox... They were real driver's cars on a budget (relatively speaking because BMW'S were much more expensive than mainstream cars).

For example, in the old times, you could order your "regular" BMW with all the extra tasty bits, which is exactly what my E21 323i has, ie an LSD and close-ratio gearbox.

Therefore the M Performance thing is just a marketing term to rename these "is" versions of old...

[HighlandPete]

Originally Posted by Paul-Bracq-BMW

I Think the debate about a real M and the M Performance is old...

...Therefore the M Performance thing is just a marketing term to rename these "is" versions of old...

Agree it is nothing new, even the Mxxx model designation has years of BMW heritage. Take as an example the E28 5-series, 535i (with many options), the M535i and the true M5.

[BimmerRookie]

Originally Posted by ZigmundUK

I guess if prestige is what you're going for. If it's driving pleasure then it shouldn't matter right?

It a skittle but of both. Have you owned an M? It's a special experience and it feels like BMW has no loyalty or structure really to their brand anymore. With every model becoming so close in capability, what's the point?

[BimmerRookie]

Originally Posted by SCOTT26

Just like Mercedes-Benz and their AMG models and AMG Line which is their equivalent to M.Sport/M.Performance.

Correct. Selling out, as I see it. "Enticing" customers by brand badging.

"My 440M sport has the Mpackage, it's basically the same thing. So I put an M badge on the back."

[ZigmundUK]

Originally Posted by BimmerRookie

It a skittle but of both. Have you owned an M? It's a special experience and it feels like BMW has no loyalty or structure really to their brand anymore. With every model becoming so close in capability, what's the point?

Unfortunately no but I doubt I ever will. Jiminy Cricket usually stops it before it becomes a fully formed thought.

[HighlandPete]

Originally Posted by BimmerRookie

Correct. Selling out, as I see it. "Enticing" customers by brand badging.

Or... supplying customers what they want.

Again a UK perspective, M-sport models are the common purchase over here. Option list including "M-sport suspension delete", says something about the user market.

Is BMW 'enticing' users, or did the market go overboard in 'choosing' the M-sport range? Over here the market settled with a high percentage of M-sport sales. Customers choose what they want, they do influence future sales and marketing.

That's business. How are you "selling out" when you give the customer what they want?

[michal12]

European reviews of this engine (already on sale in Europe for some time in 750d) have unfortunately not been positive:
-crap noise
-poor performance (only a small improvement over base diesel 730d)
-it basically uses 2 turbos, never 4 simultaneously

Way to go still seems to be the 740d/future 540d.

Meanwhile, Audi is receiving raving reviews of its new diesel V8 with 48volt architecture and electric turbo/compressor.

[clbmw]

Originally Posted by michal12

European reviews of this engine (already on sale in Europe for some time in 750d) have unfortunately not been positive:
-crap noise
-poor performance (only a small improvement over base diesel 730d)
-it basically uses 2 turbos, never 4 simultaneously

Way to go still seems to be the 740d/future 540d.

Meanwhile, Audi is receiving raving reviews of its new diesel V8 with 48volt architecture and electric turbo/compressor.

Got any links to these please?

[kozzi]

Originally Posted by HighlandPete

Agree it is nothing new, even the Mxxx model designation has years of BMW heritage. Take as an example the E28 5-series, 535i (with many options), the M535i and the true M5.

No clue what you were talking about here...so I looked it up. Thank you for this. I had no idea "M-Performance" had this in its history (1981) and partially hand built no less.

[michal12]

You may need to use google translate for this article:

http://www.auto.cz/test-bmw-750ld-xd...21?cely-clanek

Interesting parts (via google translate):

After starting, the six-cylinder unit may be a bit louder than a luxury class, but it will calm down over time. But if she took off at the volume, I would not mind. Meanwhile, I am moving around the editorial board, so the gas pedal loads so lightly - like the SQ7, the BMW 750Ld xDrive responds sensibly, with caution, the immediate newton meter would be more damaging.

So. Prague behind me and finally I'm really walking on the pedal of gas. I'm looking forward to a take-off similar to the "electric" eight-cylinder SQ7, the torque explosion, the four-speed megazathah! And it came ... I'm afraid of a slight disappointment. The racket is, let's say, more than decent, but I would be forced to breathe in the seat, not again. Yes, the cooperation of four turbochargers resulted in a perfectly smooth stroke, I did not see any jump of torque around two thousand revolutions. But ... When I recall the Audi revolution several times. Or a velvety velvet and yet brutally fast gasoline noble 750i ...
In the discipline of 60 to 100 km / h, the BMW 750Ld xDrive handled the four in 2.9 seconds, and for five, the six-cylinder needed a second more. For comparison, I extracted the BMW 730d xDrive results from our archive. Thus, a 195 kW diesel engine that delivers an acceleration of 5.8 seconds to a hundred. The weaker sevens took the fourth gear in the same discipline in 3.9 seconds. At five at the same time as the four-stroke. I guess I would expect the new stuff to hit the 730d even better, but move to accelerate from 80 to 120 km / h. We will be accelerating this time exclusively at five.

With the four-stroke six-cylinder engine I am writing in the 3.9 s chart, BMW 730d xDrive was measured by Honza Mička 4.6 s. The Bavarian rider, the aluminum Jaguar XJ with the 3.0d / 221 kW engine, needed 4.3 seconds. The 750Ld xDrive showed very decent performances, but it was clearly not a miracle.


Or fun review with ENG subs:

(engine talk @ 5:36)

Originally Posted by clbmw

Got any links to these please?

[clbmw]

Originally Posted by michal12

You may need to use google translate for this article:

http://www.auto.cz/test-bmw-750ld-xd...21?cely-clanek

Interesting parts (via google translate):

After starting, the six-cylinder unit may be a bit louder than a luxury class, but it will calm down over time. But if she took off at the volume, I would not mind. Meanwhile, I am moving around the editorial board, so the gas pedal loads so lightly - like the SQ7, the BMW 750Ld xDrive responds sensibly, with caution, the immediate newton meter would be more damaging.

So. Prague behind me and finally I'm really walking on the pedal of gas. I'm looking forward to a take-off similar to the "electric" eight-cylinder SQ7, the torque explosion, the four-speed megazathah! And it came ... I'm afraid of a slight disappointment. The racket is, let's say, more than decent, but I would be forced to breathe in the seat, not again. Yes, the cooperation of four turbochargers resulted in a perfectly smooth stroke, I did not see any jump of torque around two thousand revolutions. But ... When I recall the Audi revolution several times. Or a velvety velvet and yet brutally fast gasoline noble 750i ...
In the discipline of 60 to 100 km / h, the BMW 750Ld xDrive handled the four in 2.9 seconds, and for five, the six-cylinder needed a second more. For comparison, I extracted the BMW 730d xDrive results from our archive. Thus, a 195 kW diesel engine that delivers an acceleration of 5.8 seconds to a hundred. The weaker sevens took the fourth gear in the same discipline in 3.9 seconds. At five at the same time as the four-stroke. I guess I would expect the new stuff to hit the 730d even better, but move to accelerate from 80 to 120 km / h. We will be accelerating this time exclusively at five.

With the four-stroke six-cylinder engine I am writing in the 3.9 s chart, BMW 730d xDrive was measured by Honza Mička 4.6 s. The Bavarian rider, the aluminum Jaguar XJ with the 3.0d / 221 kW engine, needed 4.3 seconds. The 750Ld xDrive showed very decent performances, but it was clearly not a miracle.


Or fun review with ENG subs:

(engine talk @ 5:36)

Wonder if the engine will be tweeked by M for the M550d... the N55 and B58 in the M Performance 1er and 2er is in a higher power state than the equivalent 3er/4er (i.e. 340i 440i)

[Bahram]

Originally Posted by clbmw

Yeah we missed out on the last one due to RHD not being compatible with with xdrive. Wonder what the excuse will be this time...

Bring this to the US and I will replace my wife's 2016 328d wagon with this in a heartbeat.

[Bahram]

I hear even the next 3 series wagon will not come to the US.

[UnionJackAzz]

It is just sad seeing all these amazing models which won't land in North America anytime soon ... it's just sad. We as North Americans are in love with wagons, I mean it's either a wagon or a van ... nuff said?

[clbmw]

Is the US getting M550i wagon (tourer)?

[roastbeef]

I hope this engine gets put into an X5.

[bunker]

Originally Posted by clbmw

Is the US getting M550i wagon (tourer)?

facepalm

no m8

[remmib]

Originally Posted by clbmw

Is the US getting M550i wagon (tourer)?

No G31 in the US.

[clbmw]

I'm not sure when in a globalised, consumer led, free trading, liberal economic world we began to so many restrictions on which cars we can buy because the manufacturers claim we don't want to buy it.

It beggars belief