M4 vs TRACTION

[M6-Coupe]

LOL.... Again

[myzmak]

Originally Posted by M6-Coupe

LOL.... Again

Yeah, WHO coulda seen it coming.....

[dkhm3]

Originally Posted by brava09

The E92 M3 understeers as well...give it enough speed at a slow corner entry and it will keep straight.

In my RS5 never experienced understeer, while in my former E92 M3 it happened a couple of times when the front wheels lost the grip.


Please note that I am talking from my own experience in both cars, while you are just assuming/imagining about the RS5.

Found these for your reference. Unless you have a unicorn of an RS5, it has the tendency to understeer and be front heavy.

"if you stay away from the limit", "where the car will go into terminal understeer" it is absolutely brilliant.

you can see car plow on corners- does not have sharp turn in. It is a good road car, like an RC-F.

[sampelligrino]

Originally Posted by myzmak

Yeah, WHO coulda seen it coming.....

Hate to be a part of furthering any sort of misunderstanding, but I have to ask: as a daily driver in wet conditions, how does the F8x perform? The reason is that I'll likely be moving from Hawaii (summer, dry conditions 95% of the time) to Seattle (rain 50% of the time, some hills in the city). I'm going to get my M3 while in Hawaii for a bit of time, then ship it to Seattle is the plan.

I'm now having a bit of second thoughts on whether I'll take delivery or pick up something with more utility in the wet Seattle conditions like an M235i X-Drive, or a 3 series with X drive.

For just regular casual driving, will traction be an issue in the M3 in wet conditions? I don't really push my cars to their limits, I more enjoy the aesthetic/sound/sport heritage of the car and maybe just open it up on the freeway on occasion. So for regular average driving, will the back end be stepping out a bit with DSC fully on? Because that's not something I initially anticipated!

[myzmak]

Originally Posted by sampelligrino

Hate to be a part of furthering any sort of misunderstanding, but I have to ask: as a daily driver in wet conditions, how does the F8x perform? The reason is that I'll likely be moving from Hawaii (summer, dry conditions 95% of the time) to Seattle (rain 50% of the time, some hills in the city). I'm going to get my M3 while in Hawaii for a bit of time, then ship it to Seattle is the plan.

I'm now having a bit of second thoughts on whether I'll take delivery or pick up something with more utility in the wet Seattle conditions like an M235i X-Drive, or a 3 series with X drive.

For just regular casual driving, will traction be an issue in the M3 in wet conditions? I don't really push my cars to their limits, I more enjoy the aesthetic/sound/sport heritage of the car and maybe just open it up on the freeway on occasion. So for regular average driving, will the back end be stepping out a bit with DSC fully on? Because that's not something I initially anticipated!

No worries.

Ask Lups or solstice or GregW / Oregon, all good members from the NW

I think they will say Seattle weather is no problem at all for an F8X

I live in a more extreme enviro (calgary) and, yeah, no problem. Back end never steps out with DSC fully on. If I floor it from a stop on icy roads, sure, I get some squiggle. But that is the extent of the drama.

My view is winter tires are best if the temp is likely to drop below 7C (whatever thatbis in F) but, otherwise, no problem at all. Like any high performance car, though, take it easy in rough weather. You can't drive it in a snowstorm like you can on the Utah salt flats, right? Beyond that, you'll be fine.

[Lups]

Originally Posted by sampelligrino

Hate to be a part of furthering any sort of misunderstanding, but I have to ask: as a daily driver in wet conditions, how does the F8x perform? The reason is that I'll likely be moving from Hawaii (summer, dry conditions 95% of the time) to Seattle (rain 50% of the time, some hills in the city). I'm going to get my M3 while in Hawaii for a bit of time, then ship it to Seattle is the plan.

I'm now having a bit of second thoughts on whether I'll take delivery or pick up something with more utility in the wet Seattle conditions like an M235i X-Drive, or a 3 series with X drive.

For just regular casual driving, will traction be an issue in the M3 in wet conditions? I don't really push my cars to their limits, I more enjoy the aesthetic/sound/sport heritage of the car and maybe just open it up on the freeway on occasion. So for regular average driving, will the back end be stepping out a bit with DSC fully on? Because that's not something I initially anticipated!

Dude even a female can keep it on the road in Seattle.

Edit.

Well it's true. Its my daily and I probably have more k's than anyone I this generation. I never have tc on mdm only on super serious world is about to end situations and when I have other people on board.

Third set of back tires though.... That should tell how well I can be an adult.

22 000 km. 12k in Seattle and abt 8 of those alone in the car.

[sampelligrino]

Originally Posted by Lups

Dude even a female can keep it on the road in Seattle.

Edit.

Well it's true. Its my daily and I probably have more k's than anyone I this generation. I never have tc on mdm only on super serious world is about to end situations and when I have other people on board.

Third set of back tires though.... That should tell how well I can be an adult.

22 000 km. 12k in Seattle and abt 8 of those alone in the car.

LOL just asked kind of the same thing in the PNW thread Thanks for your reply

[Lups]

Originally Posted by sampelligrino

LOL just asked kind of the same thing in the PNW thread Thanks for your reply

Dude I can't wait for you to join our ranks! In the northwest we have managed something completely weird, we have a really cool (engineers, geeks, and well, me (something's don't fit any box given)) group and our love for stupid mods and even more so for the stories behind them makes us pretty funny.

Unlike many, we don't share success stories so get all the humiliating stuff ready for us. it can't be worse than what the rest of have done, we even have a pink M3 photo!

[brava09]

Originally Posted by dkhm3

you are not driving hard enough. leave your wife or g/f or your chihuahua/pomeranian out of the car and go to a place with few cars and curves.

Again, my old s4 had the same formula. front heavy, engine mounted too far in front of the wheels. Quattro AWD. It causes textbook understeer, look it up. Look up every reviewers issue with Audi AWD cars.

Your E92's understeer can be corrected because the car's handling is balanced, so you can induce power oversteer.

Whereas your RS5, once grip is lost it understeers...

So I was driving the E92 M3 hard enough to make it understeer, but I'm not driving the RS5 hard enough to make it oversteer? That means that the RS5 needs to be driven harder than the E92 M3 in order to make it oversteer, which means the RS5 is less prone to oversteer.

Again, you're pointing me all sort of magazine reviews.....I'm talking from experience with both cars.

[dkhm3]

Originally Posted by brava09

So I was driving the E92 M3 hard enough to make it understeer, but I'm not driving the RS5 hard enough to make it oversteer? That means that the RS5 needs to be driven harder than the E92 M3 in order to make it oversteer, which means the RS5 is less prone to oversteer.

Again, you're pointing me all sort of magazine reviews.....I'm talking from experience with both cars.

Congratulations! You have a Unicorn! A one of a kind car that defies the laws of physics!

Try rubbing it and see if a Genie comes out and grant you some wishes!

[dkhm3]

Originally Posted by Alex07M3

In fact the S55 is one of the engine I was speaking of when I said that some turbo engine run out of breath at higher speed, a bit like the 1M engine. That's the exact reason why a FOB E9x get destroyed by a F8x in the lower gear but yet is capable of running beside it at higher highway speed, that also explain why this E60 M5 is passing him later on after getting passed in the beginning of the race.

Yes, a larger displacement engine will pull harder at higher speeds.

[dkhm3]

Originally Posted by sampelligrino

Hate to be a part of furthering any sort of misunderstanding, but I have to ask: as a daily driver in wet conditions, how does the F8x perform? The reason is that I'll likely be moving from Hawaii (summer, dry conditions 95% of the time) to Seattle (rain 50% of the time, some hills in the city). I'm going to get my M3 while in Hawaii for a bit of time, then ship it to Seattle is the plan.

I'm now having a bit of second thoughts on whether I'll take delivery or pick up something with more utility in the wet Seattle conditions like an M235i X-Drive, or a 3 series with X drive.

For just regular casual driving, will traction be an issue in the M3 in wet conditions? I don't really push my cars to their limits, I more enjoy the aesthetic/sound/sport heritage of the car and maybe just open it up on the freeway on occasion. So for regular average driving, will the back end be stepping out a bit with DSC fully on? Because that's not something I initially anticipated!

If it were my money, I would not get the M for wet climates. GT-R would be a better choice if your budget suffices, it is one AWD car that seems to have minimized understeer.

[ss134]

Originally Posted by brava09

Really? you're not going to dispatch any RS5 in the dry, unless you go above 100mph. By the time you are busy modulating the first and second gear in the M4, the RS5 is long gone...need to play catch up.

The M4 would be faster than the RS5 only at triple digits speed.

Yes . Really. From a roll the F80 is on a different level of performance to the RS5, not even close.

[8600RPM]

Watch rs4 video avaiable on forums. F80 absolutely crushes it. This the 450 hp v8 rs4

[Falafel Combo]

Originally Posted by CanAutM3

That is the beauty of the S55, it does not run out of breath at high speed. It keeps peak power all the way to 7300RPM.

...

Is this really true? That would be impressive. I remember reading somewhere (fuzzy memory) that power falls off around 5800 rpm?

[brava09]

Yeah, I've seen enough that cars and coffee video, the M4 got no traction on lower gears. If you keep the nannies on the M4 will just cut the power and go nowhere, if you switch them off it goes fast on the wrong lane.

All, enjoy your M4, it's a great car, but traction it's not got. Don't kid yourselves and be careful, nannies on and easy on the throttle on 1st and 2nd gear.

[CanAutM3]

Originally Posted by Falafel Combo

Is this really true? That would be impressive. I remember reading somewhere (fuzzy memory) that power falls off around 5800 rpm?

That is what the haters like to say.

According to the official BMW specs, the S55 starts making its peak power at 5500RPM and it plateaus all the way to 7300RPM. It is the torque that starts to fall off after 5500RPM.

Further, on the more reliable chassis dyno charts, it seems that the S55 even continues to make more power past 5500 where the power plateau start more in the 6000RPM range to be then maintained all the way to 7300RPM.

To maximize acceleration, you need to maximize power. So keeping revs above 5500~6000RPM is where the fun is .

[Alex07M3]

Originally Posted by dkhm3

If it were my money, I would not get the M for wet climates. GT-R would be a better choice if your budget suffices, it is one AWD car that seems to have minimized understeer.

For what Sanpelligrino will be doing with its car(sounds like he does'nt need all the performance of an M4), I think just a S5 with a tune would be a great choice, that's the car I'd get for daily driving in a mostly wet climate, RS5 would be more fun at many places but not in the streets of San Fran and M4, well not the best choice for driving in the rain half of the time(if you like to have fun).

[Alex07M3]

Originally Posted by Falafel Combo

Is this really true? That would be impressive. I remember reading somewhere (fuzzy memory) that power falls off around 5800 rpm?

I think you're mixing up with tuned F8x, the guys running a lot of boost see the power start decreasing drasticly from 5000-5500rpm, a stock or conservativly tuned S55 does'nt see power dropping much until almost redline.

[Alex07M3]

Originally Posted by dkhm3

Yes, a larger displacement engine will pull harder at higher speeds.

The size of the turbo(s) makes a big difference too!

[dkhm3]

Originally Posted by brava09

Yeah, I've seen enough that cars and coffee video, the M4 got no traction on lower gears. If you keep the nannies on the M4 will just cut the power and go nowhere, if you switch them off it goes fast on the wrong lane.

All, enjoy your M4, it's a great car, but traction it's not got. Don't kid yourselves and be careful, nannies on and easy on the throttle on 1st and 2nd gear.

Ya, that happens all the time. That's why there are so many people crashing their Ms during street races.

Have you ever driven a turbo rwd car? You a little bit of skill.

[dkhm3]

Originally Posted by Falafel Combo

Is this really true? That would be impressive. I remember reading somewhere (fuzzy memory) that power falls off around 5800 rpm?

There is no power drop off on the M. as discussed previously. This is not an N54.