09132017, 07:21 PM  #24  
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The alpina has its own value prop I understand. Again I was expecting hp to be a notch up from the M550d when I read the title is all I'm saying
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09132017, 07:26 PM  #25  
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Who knows...maybe there's more yet to come from all 3 sides. 

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09132017, 09:20 PM  #26 
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Was just about to tag you in this...!

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09132017, 09:28 PM  #27 
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That color is gorgeous.
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09132017, 09:42 PM  #28 
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That's one nice typewriter ! Wagon yesssss
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09132017, 10:01 PM  #29  
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Still, a great machine. I would love one. 

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09142017, 12:32 AM  #30  
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This car is slower than an E92 M3 which only has 295 lbft. An F10 M5 will destroy this car on the road. This car is almost dead even with a G30 540i... 

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09142017, 12:46 AM  #31 
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It's a cool car but it's a diesel sorry and diesels seem to get more punishment and scapegoat as though they do nothing but pollute the environment .It may be a speculation or not but diesel cars might be banned from entering major cities so if holds a truth then diesel cars should have no future.
It wouldn't replace my G30 however cool and greatly modified it is
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09142017, 03:02 AM  #33  
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Torque is how much twisting force the engine generates at its shaft for a particular speed of rotation (Torque = Force x Perpendicular distance > Nm) Higher torque means better acceleration. The more available torque at lower speed, the better. If you want an engine to spin faster, you have to give it more torque. HP is a product of the torque. Since you are mentioning a passenger car (not even a sports car  no trunk, no radio, no excessive weight, etc.) I believe that this car is stunning. A passenger car has 45 seats, a trunk, etc. A gas vehicle needs to stay all the time at high Revolution to achieve a certain torque, while the diesel has the torque available instantly and effortless. At around 5000 RPM, torque and HP are equal. At any RPM below 5000, the value of torque is greater than the value of HP; Above 5000 RPM, the value of HP is higher. Gas car stays sharp and nimble as long as you are on top of the game. It requires permanent attention and peak time with proper gear choice. > more gas, less fuel economy. Diesel has a linear torque curve, it's power line is pretty much stable and available anytime you need it > better fuel economy. You get more energy from 1 liter of diesel and diesel gets a hell of a lot better mileage than gas cars. Just add more weight and the gas car will loose the game, while diesel will run pretty much the same. If you need acceleration, the torque is the one that will give it to you. Sorry, Power DOES NOT reflect the capability for acceleration much better. Power is related to the top (higher) speed while the torque is related to the Acceleration. The more Torque your engine generates, the more quickly your car accelerates. we can't ignore the advantages of a diesel. If you drive a lot, diesel should be the first choice. Is relaxed, powerful and extremely efficient engine, that will also have a better longevity than gas engines. PS M3 and G30 are two different animals. 

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09142017, 03:28 AM  #34 
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I'm a fan of big diesels  have had 535d's and also an A8 with 370hp/800Nm  but this actually leaves me cold. 3 problems for Alpina:
 the G30 is already quite a supple car from the factory with a much better ride and handling compromise than the F10, so there is less need to migrate to Alpina in the first place;  most of their target market can get the 540d or M550d, which are both already fast beyond the point where anyone can say "I'm getting it for the sense of effortless acceleration rather than for the onpaper performance figures";  the fuel economy is terrible: 530d xdrive gets 25% better figures than this. I love BMW's 3 litre diesel lump but what is the point of it if its CO2 emissions/fueldensityadjusted mpg figures are basically the same as a 540i ? 
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09142017, 03:36 AM  #35 
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"Power is related to the top (higher) speed while the torque is related to the Acceleration. The more Torque your engine generates, the more quickly your car accelerates"
Simply not true. Acceleration results from the application of power. Power from an ICE engine is a function of torque and angular velocity. 
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09142017, 03:40 AM  #36  
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Last edited by chris719; 09142017 at 03:46 AM.. 

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09142017, 03:42 AM  #37  
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09142017, 04:46 AM  #38  
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It's like comparing fruits to pork right now. Not even an apples to oranges hypothesis is reasonable. This car is FASTER and QUICKER than the M550i, has variable AWD similar to the F90, yet will very much be an economical cruiser if you want it to be. 

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09142017, 07:44 AM  #39 
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That wagon is so bad ass!!!!

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09142017, 08:07 AM  #40  
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At least if it refers to the previous M550d, which was also a triturbo setup (and not with 4 turbo chargers as the new M550d). I wonder whether Alpina simply took the previous engine (a slightly modified N57), or whether they removed a turbo charger from the new M550d (B57). The figures are almost identical to the old M550d, just the torque figure is somewhat higher with 800 Nm compared to 740. I also don't think they designed new pistons for this engine. They sometimes do that for the petrol models, but for the Diesel ones that does not seem to make much sense to me.
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09142017, 11:52 AM  #41  
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Why don’t Formula 1 cars have torque? The goal of Formula 1 is to not accelerate. You want to be at your highest top speed possible all of the time, so Formula 1 cars are designed to maintain high speeds and thus stay in the high rpms where all of the power is. You do need torque to accelerate quickly after slowing down for a corner, but since Formula 1 cars take corners at most cars’ top speeds they don’t need a lot. Any given car, in any given gear, will accelerate at a rate that exactly matches its torque curve (allowing for increased air and rolling resistance as speeds climb). Another way of saying this is that a car will accelerate hardest at its torque peak in any given gear, and will not accelerate as hard below that peak, or above it. Torque is the only thing that a driver feels, and horsepower is just sort of an esoteric measurement in that context. 300 foot pounds of torque will accelerate you just as hard at 2000 rpm as it would if you were making that torque at 4000 rpm in the same gear, yet, per the formula, the horsepower would be double at 4000 rpm. Therefore, horsepower isn't particularly meaningful from a driver's perspective, and the two numbers only get friendly at 5252 rpm, where horsepower and torque always come out the same. Torque alone determines acceleration. That's not an opinion, it is mathematical certainty, and a basic principle of physics. HP is simply the mathematical product of torque and RPM. Please have a read. https://www.carthrottle.com/post/werzmjy/ I am out of this argument. 

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09142017, 12:58 PM  #43 
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I'm at the point now where I basically want everything Alpina is making, diesels included
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09142017, 01:03 PM  #44  
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I know what you mean, you choose HP because your HP represent the total torque that gets delivered to the wheel (raw power plus RPM). Gearing magnifies torque and makes the difference. So, If the design objective is performance instead of low fuel consumption, the diesel engine can perform adequately. BMW M550d xDrive 3.0 liter turbo diesel 6cyl engine 060 mph in 4.7 sec. BMW 535i xDrive 3.0 liter turbo 6cyl gas 060 mph in 5.7 seconds. See Audi winning LeMans with diesel please. 

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