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      07-19-2019, 08:43 AM   #1
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Trudeau expresses views on Free Speech.

So our PM yesterday at a summit in Montreal while commenting on Trumps Tweets about the Squad said:

"The comments made were hurtful, wrong and completely unacceptable," the prime minister said. "And I want everyone in Canada to know that those comments are completely unacceptable and should not be allowed or encouraged in Canada."

The Charter of Rights and Freedoms protects free expression which is free speech, one of the exceptions is hate speech. Trumps tweets might offend some but they do not come any where near the threshold for "hate speech"

So my point is that our PM the liberal feels that free expression he doesn't approve us should not be allowed.

Video of the remarks are attached, on a side note I think he might have been a bit stoned....

https://bc.ctvnews.ca/video?clipId=1732683
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      07-19-2019, 09:06 AM   #2
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Surprise surprise. Trudeau revealing more of his colours. I really don't want to think about 4 more years with this turkey at the helm.
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he's Canadian. By international law we all must worship him and all other products of the country.
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      07-20-2019, 10:22 PM   #3
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I am not Canadian but it seems smart not to incite division among us with irresponsible rhetoric, if one is considered the leader of the free world.
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      07-21-2019, 08:01 AM   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by irishbimmer View Post
I am not Canadian but it seems smart not to incite division among us with irresponsible rhetoric, if one is considered the leader of the free world.
So I gather you're referring to Trump, and I think it's unfortunate that so many people lose their minds every time he opens his mouth. If someone else were to make the same comments who wasn't so universally hated by the left I don't think the response would be the same. Why my concern is the Prime Minister of a country that has a Charter that guarantees Free Expression (Free Speech) among other things would suggest that any remark that didn't even come close to hate speech not be allowed. Think about that for a second. Isn't it similar to that Florida congresswoman who suggested recently that criticism of congress on line should be outlawed. How did that go over?
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      07-21-2019, 09:18 AM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by irishbimmer View Post
I am not Canadian but it seems smart not to incite division among us with irresponsible rhetoric, if one is considered the leader of the free world.
What a surprise a Lefty that doesn't believe in free speech by those they disagree with.

Canada is such a fabulous country and Canadians have a proud history of fighting along side the U.S. But people that do not read and comprehend history will elect asshats like .

Imagine him saying "comments like this should not be allowed" of course then he added "or encouraged"..I understand he is having a bonfire next week to burn history books.

So he will be Prime minister for life?

Last edited by adc100; 07-21-2019 at 09:27 AM..
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      07-21-2019, 12:19 PM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by adc100 View Post
What a surprise a Lefty that doesn't believe in free speech by those they disagree with.

Canada is such a fabulous country and Canadians have a proud history of fighting along side the U.S. But people that do not read and comprehend history will elect asshats like .

Imagine him saying "comments like this should not be allowed" of course then he added "or encouraged"..I understand he is having a bonfire next week to burn history books.

So he will be Prime minister for life?
There are no term limits on the Prime Minister. He can stay in office as long as there are enough sheep willing to vote for his party.
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      07-21-2019, 02:01 PM   #7
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Just sayin' what your mom probably taught you-"ya catch more flies with honey", etc. The freedom of speech thing can be carried out to extremes to our detriment from both sides of the aisle. Its time to tone it down.
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      07-21-2019, 02:05 PM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by irishbimmer View Post
Just sayin' what your mom probably taught you-"ya catch more flies with honey", etc. The freedom of speech thing can be carried out to extremes to our detriment from both sides of the aisle. Its time to tone it down.
I may hate what you say but I'll defend your right to say it. If you don't like something turn off the channel.

Last edited by City Pig; 07-21-2019 at 02:25 PM..
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      07-23-2019, 04:03 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Grumpy Old Man View Post
If someone else were to make the same comments who wasn't so universally hated by the left I don't think the response would be the same. Why my concern is the Prime Minister of a country that has a Charter that guarantees Free Expression (Free Speech) among other things would suggest that any remark that didn't even come close to hate speech not be allowed. Think about that for a second. Isn't it similar to that Florida congresswoman who suggested recently that criticism of congress on line should be outlawed. How did that go over?
Its not just the left. Its also those who laud accountability and the truth. Those who are country before party. Trudeau is a poor leader, but is ultimely garden variety.
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      07-23-2019, 04:11 PM   #10
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Originally Posted by Zugzwang View Post
And what garden variety “parasite” would he be? My guess would be blight.
I was thinking "ladybug".
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      07-23-2019, 06:02 PM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Grumpy Old Man View Post
I may hate what you say but I'll defend your right to say it. If you don't like something turn off the channel.
I think as a leader there are ways that things must be said versus blurted for best results. This is true in my businesses where I've been making payroll for 35 years as well as the world's stage. Its the way things must be done.

A leader must find ways to unite dissimilar job functions in companies and diverse elements of society in politics for maximum results.

Attacking diversity through careless speech only promotes disunity and eventually limits the success of the individual and country.
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      07-23-2019, 08:20 PM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by irishbimmer View Post
I think as a leader there are ways that things must be said versus blurted for best results. This is true in my businesses where I've been making payroll for 35 years as well as the world's stage. Its the way things must be done.

A leader must find ways to unite dissimilar job functions in companies and diverse elements of society in politics for maximum results.

Attacking diversity through careless speech only promotes disunity and eventually limits the success of the individual and country.
It would be nice if leaders were all gentleman and ladies, but that's not the point and that's not what Trudeau said.....he said this type of language shouldn't be allowed in Canada. And regardless, it's called Free Speech, not Restricted or moderated or government controlled speech......like I said, I might hate what's being said but I'd defend you right to say it.
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      07-23-2019, 10:37 PM   #13
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Understand-anyone can say anything but what's the point?
It just turns into chaos.
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      07-24-2019, 07:16 AM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by irishbimmer View Post
Understand-anyone can say anything but what's the point?
It just turns into chaos.
Ok, so maybe this will help. Let's say we decide to limit some speech or words. Who get's to decide what words, what speech, what thoughts? What's the mechanism for enforcing those limits? And I think it's pretty obvious that the list of words, speech and thought will grow, that would be chaos my friend.
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      07-26-2019, 09:01 AM   #15
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context...

I think Trudeau meant to say that such speech should not be allowed to people in leadership positions. I don't think he is concerned with what someone might say in a bar. I can guarantee you that if a U.S. CEO used such language the EEOC would be all over him, and the shareholders of any public company would quickly dispense with his services. It is a peculiarity of the U.S. that POTUS is largely exempt from accountability - something that Trump exploits every day. In Canada no political leader would remain in office after directing racist slurs at colleagues. Ironically in Canada we lack the rigid standards that the EEOC enforces in the U.S. private sector.
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      07-26-2019, 09:04 AM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BimmerBoomer View Post
I think Trudeau meant to say that such speech should not be allowed to people in leadership positions. I don't think he is concerned with what someone might say in a bar. I can guarantee you that if a U.S. CEO used such language the EEOC would be all over him, and the shareholders of any public company would quickly dispense with his services. It is a peculiarity of the U.S. that POTUS is largely exempt from accountability - something that Trump exploits every day. In Canada no political leader would remain in office after directing racist slurs at colleagues. Ironically in Canada we lack the rigid standards that the EEOC enforces in the U.S. private sector.
"I think Trudeau meant to say that such speech should not be allowed to people in leadership positions."

I don't think so, he never clarified that as his position and I think if you look at some of the other things he's said I think he meant exactly what he said.
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      07-26-2019, 09:19 AM   #17
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really?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Grumpy Old Man View Post
"I think Trudeau meant to say that such speech should not be allowed to people in leadership positions."

I don't think so, he never clarified that as his position and I think if you look at some of the other things he's said I think he meant exactly what he said.
So, exactly what do you think he has in mind? A network of informants in neighbourhoods and workplaces as in the Soviet Bloc in Stalin's time? You're sounding more Shrill than Grumpy.
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      07-26-2019, 09:27 AM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BimmerBoomer View Post
So, exactly what do you think he has in mind? A network of informants in neighbourhoods and workplaces as in the Soviet Bloc in Stalin's time? You're sounding more Shrill than Grumpy.
Liberal governments like to regulate everything, rules, laws and bans. Both myself and wife have worked in government. Our experience has been that they will implement laws and regulations that there is zero ability to enforce....its a feel good exercise, with the risk being that when it is enforced it's not enforced equally, it usually results from a complaint from someone who is triggered.
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      07-26-2019, 01:45 PM   #19
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nonsense...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Grumpy Old Man View Post
Liberal governments like to regulate everything, rules, laws and bans. Both myself and wife have worked in government. Our experience has been that they will implement laws and regulations that there is zero ability to enforce....its a feel good exercise, with the risk being that when it is enforced it's not enforced equally, it usually results from a complaint from someone who is triggered.
Such legislation (with respect to limiting free speech) would clearly violate the Charter. Who do we owe our Charter of Rights and Freedoms to?
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      07-26-2019, 03:42 PM   #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BimmerBoomer View Post
Such legislation (with respect to limiting free speech) would clearly violate the Charter. Who do we owe our Charter of Rights and Freedoms to?
It would violate the charter who was authored by PET, the father of our current PM. I didn't care for PET but he was at least intelligent.

The charter is a living thing, and the fact that JT would even say something like this should be a concern to all of us regardless of political leaning.

All you need to do is look at the suggestions that there be a ban on guns to stop gun violence. It might feel good but it's misplaced. The response to language that some might find unpleasant should be debate not a suggestion to ban the language.
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      07-27-2019, 12:35 AM   #21
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well, no...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Grumpy Old Man View Post
The response to language that some might find unpleasant should be debate not a suggestion to ban the language.
Racism is just flat out wrong, and when someone in a position of power is espousing it it should indeed be criminal or at least lead to severe civil penalties - like losing a good job.
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      07-27-2019, 07:11 AM   #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BimmerBoomer View Post
Racism is just flat out wrong, and when someone in a position of power is espousing it it should indeed be criminal or at least lead to severe civil penalties - like losing a good job.
So I'm not sure how what Trump said was racist if that's what you're referring to. And even if we agreed that his comments were racist it doesn't meet the threshold of hate speech, it doesn't even come close so it should be protected under the charter as Free Expression, and Trudeaus comments were wrong.
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