BMW Garage BMW Meets Register Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read
BIMMERPOST Universal Forums Sim Racing BMW Drivers Discuss Sim Racing Rigs

Post Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
      05-08-2020, 10:25 AM   #1
Jason
Administrator
Jason's Avatar
United_States
40111
Rep
21,227
Posts

Drives: F80 M3
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: USA

iTrader: (0)

BMW Drivers Discuss Sim Racing Rigs

BIMMERPOST NEWS
Sim racing hardware check: BMW drivers on differences between basis and high-end equipment.
25
COMMENTS
Name:  P90378454-highRes.jpg
Views: 5729
Size:  622.9 KB


May 8, 2020

Munich. Just as a real racing driver needs a customised cockpit to be successful, the right hardware is also required in sim racing if you want to compete at the highest level. The range on offer is huge – from simple basic equipment, which any amateur gamer can pick up, to high-end solutions. BMW drivers Philipp Eng (AUT) and Christian Krognes (NOR), and sim racers Laurin Heinrich and Alexander Voß (both GER) give an overview of what is on offer and reveal that the most expensive equipment does not necessarily guarantee the fastest lap times.

Sim rig, force feedback, direct drive and widescreen are meaningful terms to those heavily involved in sim racing. They are just some of the hardware components that can be used in virtual races at the highest level of the discipline. Essentially, a high-end kit consists of a solid and stable metal frame, in which the racing seat is integrated – the so-called sim rig. As a rule, a rig like this also includes a screen – preferably a high-resolution one. A steering wheel with appropriate engine and a set of pedals are also obligatory.

This kind of equipment is currently allowing the likes of BMW works driver Philipp Eng to regularly take to the track in virtual BMW race cars, like the BMW M8 GTE in the IMSA iRacing Pro Series and the BMW Z4 GT3 in the Digital Nürburgring Endurance Series powered by VCO with great success. Just a few weeks ago he won the iRacing 24h Nürburgring powered by VCO – the biggest success of his sim racing career so far.

That career began at the age of 17, when he modified a racing simulator on his desk at home. “I shifted the schoolbooks to one side, clamped my steering wheel to the desk, fixed the pedals to the floor – and I was ready,” Eng recalled. Nowadays, his requirements are a little more sophisticated. “In my opinion, a stable rig that does not wobble is important. I also attach great importance to ensuring that the seat position is as close as possible to what it would be in a real race car,” said Eng. “However, the most important thing for me is a good steering wheel motor. In a static simulator, the steering wheel is the only connection I have with the track. Only through the force feedback am I able to feel how the car moves – not through my whole body, as I can in reality. Another thing that helps is the so-called direct drive, with which the virtual steering column leads directly into the engine, just like in a real race car. That results in the steering wheel reacting far more directly.”

Voß: “It is worth spending more than half your budget on a good rig and good pedals”.

Top sim racers Laurin Heinrich and Alexander Voß from the BS+COMPETITION team, who won the virtual 24-hour race on the Nordschleife alongside Eng, are real experts when it comes to equipment. On the topic of hardware, Voß said: “In my opinion, it is worth spending more than half your budget on a good rig and good pedals if you are looking to get top equipment.” His direct drive steering wheel is homemade, as that technology was not for sale when he received it seven years ago. Heinrich went a slightly different way in this regard. “I don’t have a homemade steering wheel. Instead, I recently bought a new direct drive model. I use a DTM-style steering wheel, because I am most comfortable with that.”

Like Eng, both sim racers have a 49-inch widescreen monitor with 144 hertz. “A monitor with a fast reaction time is extremely valuable, as it gives you a very realistic feeling of speed and is easier on your eyes,” Heinrich explained. Eng added: “The image transmission rate is hugely important for me to immediately see on the screen the movements that I can feel on the steering wheel without any delay.” Eng does not feel that the system often seen on the sim racing scene, with three screens to allow a larger field of vision, particularly laterally, is necessarily essential. “After all, I don’t look through the side window in a real race car.”

What equipment do you need, to be able to compete with the best?

The big question regarding hardware for sim racing is: What equipment do I need, to be able to compete with the best? Do I really need to fork out a five-figure sum for the race simulator and all the accessories?

One man currently showing that this is not necessarily the case is Walkenhorst Motorsport driver Christian Krognes. He has only been heavily involved in sim racing for a few weeks and drives a BMW Z4 GT3 in the DNLS powered by VCO. Although his equipment is more of a throwback to what Eng was using when he started out aged 17, Krognes is setting impressive lap times on the virtual Nordschleife and challenging at the front of the field. “I basically sit at a normal table, on a normal chair. During the day, I work from home as usual. Then, in the evening, I fasten my steering wheel in place and drive for a few hours,” Krognes explained. His pedals are attached to a box under the table and there is no sign of a metal sim rig holding the whole construction together. That does cause the odd issue. “If I brake too hard, I sometimes slide backwards on my stool,” said Krognes. He is now considering making himself a simple rig.

At what point does high-end equipment make sense?

How is it possible for Krognes, despite his relatively basic equipment, to keep pace in such a strong racing series as the DNLS powered by VCO? “More expensive does not necessarily mean faster,” said Eng. “There are also a lot of professional sim racers who do not have such high-quality equipment, but still show me how it is done.” Voß agreed: “You are not automatically half a second faster, just because you have invested several thousands of euros in a good simulator. You have to get used to everything – even very basic equipment. Familiarity plays a very big role. Only when it comes to squeezing out the final few tenths of a second do I think that it is easier with good equipment. In my opinion, you can perform more consistently with good pedals and a good steering wheel, in particular. It is more intuitive.” Krognes backed him up: “I don’t think I would be significantly faster with top-quality equipment, but I would probably be more consistent. A triple stint in an endurance race can be pretty uncomfortable on a normal chair.”

The good news for amateur racers is that you can get hold of hardware to be competitive in sim racing, with a manageable budget. Only if you are spending many hours a day at the wheel, or need to find the final few tenths of a second at the very highest level, does it make sense to invest in high-end equipment. Eng, Heinrich and Voß will be doing just that when back in action at the virtual Nürburgring this Sunday. This time, however, they will not be on the Nordschleife but the Grand Prix Circuit. At the wheel of the BMW M8 GTE, they will take on some of the best sim racers in the world in the BMW SIM 120 Cup. Voß and Heinrich will form one team, while Eng will drive alongside fellow BMW works driver Bruno Spengler (CAN). The race gets underway at 15:00 (CEST) on Sunday and will be streamed live on the following BMW Motorsport platforms:

Facebook: b.mw/sim120cupNBR

YouTube: b.mw/sim120cupNBR_YT

Twitch: www.twitch.tv/bmwmotorsport

Live streams of the ABB Formula E Race at Home Challenge (Sat., 16:30hrs CEST):

Facebook: b.mw/RaceAtHomeChallenge3FB

YouTube: b.mw/RaceAtHomeChallenge3YT


Name:  P90378454-highRes.jpg
Views: 5729
Size:  622.9 KB

Name:  P90378441-highRes.jpg
Views: 5422
Size:  661.7 KB

Name:  P90378448-highRes.jpg
Views: 5207
Size:  620.9 KB

Name:  P90378485-highRes.jpg
Views: 5227
Size:  658.2 KB

Name:  P90378501-highRes.jpg
Views: 5212
Size:  667.1 KB

Name:  P90378510-highRes.jpg
Views: 5233
Size:  595.2 KB


__________________
Check on the Latest BMW News
Become a fan of Bimmerpost Facebook
Follow us on Bimmerpost Twitter
Subscribe to Bimmerpost Youtube Channel
Appreciate 4
Lt1camaro185.00
Logical209.50
haagm58809.50
      05-08-2020, 11:49 AM   #2
SMED
Private
SMED's Avatar
No_Country
75
Rep
59
Posts

Drives: 21 M850xi CPE & 23 X3 M40i
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: British Columbia

iTrader: (0)

Garage List
  [0.00]
Now that's a racing set-up that I would love to have!! A lot more advanced and probably way more realistic than my old setup. Wouldn't want to know the cost of that rig though.
Attached Images
  
Appreciate 2
clee1982796.00
izzyM2618.50
      05-08-2020, 11:56 AM   #3
JCZ5
Major
JCZ5's Avatar
1483
Rep
1,369
Posts

Drives: BMW X5 (G05)
Join Date: Mar 2019
Location: PA

iTrader: (0)

I got a Playseat Challenge setup. I've been very impressed with it. Really stable and obviously folds up nicely and out of the way when you don't need it.

For a casual sim gamer, it fits my needs perfectly.
__________________
IG: @rise_n_drive
Appreciate 1
Logical209.50
      05-08-2020, 12:12 PM   #4
magha
Lieutenant
magha's Avatar
93
Rep
523
Posts

Drives: '18 M2 AW 6 spd
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Toronto

iTrader: (1)

I just got my hands on a Fanatec CSL Elite set and upgraded from a G29. Huge diff but lap times suffering as I have to get used to it
Attached Images
 
__________________

18 M2 6 Spd AW - VRSF DP / CP & Race FMIC, ER TIC & GFB DV+ with BM3 Stage 2
Retired 09 135 JB4 G5 ISO w/BEF, N54 Tuning Performance DPs, BMS DCI, ER Charge Pipe
Appreciate 0
      05-08-2020, 12:13 PM   #5
camerbmw
Private First Class
camerbmw's Avatar
No_Country
154
Rep
107
Posts

Drives: BMW iX M60
Join Date: Jul 2018
Location: Palo Alto CA

iTrader: (0)

Garage List
2023 BMW  [0.00]
Quote:
Originally Posted by JCZ5 View Post
I got a Playseat Challenge setup. I've been very impressed with it. Really stable and obviously folds up nicely and out of the way when you don't need it.

For a casual sim gamer, it fits my needs perfectly.
Invested in the last 3 years to build my perfect rig!
Attached Images
 
__________________
Speed is not required
Appreciate 6
SMED75.00
beats225.00
clee1982796.00
Solidjake944.00
Mr Pete1595.50
      05-08-2020, 12:35 PM   #6
JCZ5
Major
JCZ5's Avatar
1483
Rep
1,369
Posts

Drives: BMW X5 (G05)
Join Date: Mar 2019
Location: PA

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by camerbmw View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by JCZ5 View Post
I got a Playseat Challenge setup. I've been very impressed with it. Really stable and obviously folds up nicely and out of the way when you don't need it.

For a casual sim gamer, it fits my needs perfectly.
Invested in the last 3 years to build my perfect rig!
Man look at that! Great build!

Quote:
Originally Posted by magha View Post
I just got my hands on a Fanatec CSL Elite set and upgraded from a G29. Huge diff but lap times suffering as I have to get used to it
I just bought the CSL elite set a month ago and boy it's amazing! I just wish the hand grips were not alcantra. Been wearing racing gloves just so they don't wear out 😂
__________________
IG: @rise_n_drive
Appreciate 0
      05-08-2020, 12:53 PM   #7
magha
Lieutenant
magha's Avatar
93
Rep
523
Posts

Drives: '18 M2 AW 6 spd
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Toronto

iTrader: (1)

Quote:
Originally Posted by JCZ5 View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by camerbmw View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by JCZ5 View Post
I got a Playseat Challenge setup. I've been very impressed with it. Really stable and obviously folds up nicely and out of the way when you don't need it.

For a casual sim gamer, it fits my needs perfectly.
Invested in the last 3 years to build my perfect rig!
Man look at that! Great build!

Quote:
Originally Posted by magha View Post
I just got my hands on a Fanatec CSL Elite set and upgraded from a G29. Huge diff but lap times suffering as I have to get used to it
I just bought the CSL elite set a month ago and boy it's amazing! I just wish the hand grips were not alcantra. Been wearing racing gloves just so they don't wear out 😂
Lol same here with the gloves. Needless to say I get made fun of by the fam
__________________

18 M2 6 Spd AW - VRSF DP / CP & Race FMIC, ER TIC & GFB DV+ with BM3 Stage 2
Retired 09 135 JB4 G5 ISO w/BEF, N54 Tuning Performance DPs, BMS DCI, ER Charge Pipe
Appreciate 0
      05-08-2020, 01:10 PM   #8
izzyM2
Major
izzyM2's Avatar
619
Rep
1,199
Posts

Drives: 24’M2/21ID.4/21’MacanGTS
Join Date: Sep 2012
Location: SoCal

iTrader: (4)

Budget setup can still be competitive and fun.

You can go $10k+ Setup or my $1810 including tax setup.

FGT Cockpit - $500
TV Stand - $80
G29 with shifter - $425
Buttkicker - $170
PS4 Pro - $450
Software - $20
Attached Images
 
Appreciate 4
clee1982796.00
Solidjake944.00
SCS55290.00
      05-08-2020, 01:53 PM   #9
M3GymNut
Major
908
Rep
1,211
Posts

Drives: 2021 M3Comp
Join Date: Oct 2017
Location: Miami, FL

iTrader: (0)

For those of you that track or drive professionally and have a sim rig...how close are the simulations from the real deal? Please be specific if possible I've always been curious.
Appreciate 0
      05-08-2020, 02:27 PM   #10
GOLFFRR
GOLFFRR's Avatar
10687
Rep
27,506
Posts

Drives: GOLFFRR cart
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: we sell BMWs to "ALL" US states

iTrader: (4)

dang those are some nice set ups, wow!

also some of the post of members set up. Im jealous! Always wanted one of those, just dont think I would ever use it after a month lol
__________________

BEFORE YOU BUY YOUR NEXT BMW, PM ME FIRST WE CAN HOOK YOU UP!
Jimmy Miller:Jimmym@bmwofcamarillo.com Cell:805-509-2048
If you have any issues getting a hold of Jimmy M PLEASE PM me, I'm available everyday till 545pm!
Appreciate 0
      05-08-2020, 03:34 PM   #11
Resjudicata
Colonel
Resjudicata's Avatar
United_States
1598
Rep
2,935
Posts

Drives: M850i convertible
Join Date: Jun 2019
Location: Dulles Virginia

iTrader: (0)

Wow, so cool.
Appreciate 0
      05-08-2020, 06:54 PM   #12
///M4TT
18’ F82 ZCP
///M4TT's Avatar
United_States
150
Rep
162
Posts

Drives: 18' F82 ZCP in MGM
Join Date: Jan 2018
Location: Washington State

iTrader: (0)

Nerds.
__________________
2018 F82 ZCP MGM
Appreciate 1
izzyM2618.50
      05-09-2020, 12:18 AM   #13
akkando
Major General
akkando's Avatar
5859
Rep
6,631
Posts

Drives: 17 M2 DCT LBB,11 e90 M3 ZCP IB
Join Date: Jan 2017
Location: Bay Area

iTrader: (1)

I don't know why you would go with a monitor over VR.
Appreciate 0
      05-09-2020, 03:55 AM   #14
cpxchewy
Monkey
119
Rep
241
Posts

Drives: 2020 M2C
Join Date: Aug 2014
Location: California

iTrader: (1)

Quote:
Originally Posted by M3GymNut View Post
For those of you that track or drive professionally and have a sim rig...how close are the simulations from the real deal? Please be specific if possible I've always been curious.
It depends on which sim you use. I personally use assetto corsa and I'm about 4 seconds slower at laguna seca irl than in game but that's mainly because of me not having enough balls for turn 9,10,11. The physics of the car is fantastic and you can adjust suspension and tires and car. Each car follows their own power delivery as well, for example a e92 M3 is much easier to control in the lower rpm since it's NA vs a f80 where if you press the pedal a little too hard you'll break traction at 5k. I still can't drive a Cayman GT4 as well as a FR car because I'm not good at controlling MR driving dynamics yet (snap oversteer all day err day). In addition all tracks are scanned with elevation so characteristics of how the car adjusts with the track is there too.

Besides the lack of Gforce I would say the sim manages the car and track part of tracking very well. Plus, I can practice weak areas and not worry about over driving vs irl I could never do more than 7/10.
Appreciate 1
M3GymNut907.50
      05-09-2020, 07:55 AM   #15
Solidjake
¯\_(ツ)_/¯
Solidjake's Avatar
Poland
944
Rep
1,762
Posts

Drives: '13 328i Msport 6MT
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: NYC/SNJ

iTrader: (2)

Quote:
Originally Posted by izzyM2 View Post
You can go $10k+ Setup or my $1810 including tax setup.

FGT Cockpit - $500
TV Stand - $80
G29 with shifter - $425
Buttkicker - $170
PS4 Pro - $450
Software - $20
How is the FGT rig? That is the one I have my eye one. Might get that and maybe sell two of my three monitors or all three and just get one superwide
__________________
Tensioner/belt DIY | Side skirt extension DIY

Apex SM-10/DWS06+ | 400m/X-ice Xi3 | Injen Exhaust | Stoptech SS Lines | 335 Front Brakes
Hawk HPS 5.0 | RBF600 | ER Charge Pipes | Wagner Evo Comp 2 FMIC
Appreciate 0
      05-09-2020, 02:34 PM   #16
izzyM2
Major
izzyM2's Avatar
619
Rep
1,199
Posts

Drives: 24’M2/21ID.4/21’MacanGTS
Join Date: Sep 2012
Location: SoCal

iTrader: (4)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Solidjake View Post
How is the FGT rig? That is the one I have my eye one. Might get that and maybe sell two of my three monitors or all three and just get one superwide
I like it. You have to unscrew to make adjustments but once it's all set I was good to go. No movement at all, very solid!
Appreciate 1
Solidjake944.00
      05-10-2020, 05:15 AM   #17
fdsjkl
Private
Australia
54
Rep
93
Posts

Drives: 2014 M4
Join Date: Mar 2014
Location: QLD Australia

iTrader: (0)

My long gone rig from a few years ago:

Appreciate 0
      05-10-2020, 08:32 PM   #18
MCanadaE46
Private First Class
150
Rep
163
Posts

Drives: BMW M3 F80
Join Date: May 2015
Location: Toronto, Canada

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by izzyM2 View Post
You can go $10k+ Setup or my $1810 including tax setup.

FGT Cockpit - $500
TV Stand - $80
G29 with shifter - $425
Buttkicker - $170
PS4 Pro - $450
Software - $20
Nice. I have the F1-GT cockpit from Next Level Racing. Its the previous version of the FGT one you have. For a belt based wheel base (I'm using Fanatec Clubsport V2.5), its fairly rigid. However, going to a direct drive system, I've read reviews that it introduces noticeable play.

Here's my setup! Recently just purchased the Samsung Odyssey Plus VR headset. Haven't had time to play around with it yet, but hoping its worth the purchase.







Appreciate 1
izzyM2618.50
      05-11-2020, 01:59 AM   #19
hsb
Private
Sweden
76
Rep
87
Posts

Drives: 718 Spyder
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: Sweden

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by M3GymNut View Post
For those of you that track or drive professionally and have a sim rig...how close are the simulations from the real deal? Please be specific if possible I've always been curious.
I don't have an expensive rig but IMHO it's never going to be nowhere near the real thing. You don't have the g forces acting on you during cornering, braking, accelerating. The screen is just 2-dimensional so depth is hard to judge.
Buy a Miata and go to your local track and try, the real thing is so much more fun. With that said, it's convenient to be able to get your racing fix at home for just a few hours per day.
__________________
Porsche 718 Spyder 2020
Mazda MX-5 2018 - sold
BMW M135i xDrive 2013 - sold
Appreciate 0
      05-11-2020, 09:56 AM   #20
KurzcoupeF82
New Member
KurzcoupeF82's Avatar
United_States
14
Rep
13
Posts

Drives: M4
Join Date: Mar 2020
Location: Albuquerque, NM

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by cpxchewy View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by M3GymNut View Post
For those of you that track or drive professionally and have a sim rig...how close are the simulations from the real deal? Please be specific if possible I've always been curious.
It depends on which sim you use. I personally use assetto corsa and I'm about 4 seconds slower at laguna seca irl than in game but that's mainly because of me not having enough balls for turn 9,10,11. The physics of the car is fantastic and you can adjust suspension and tires and car. Each car follows their own power delivery as well, for example a e92 M3 is much easier to control in the lower rpm since it's NA vs a f80 where if you press the pedal a little too hard you'll break traction at 5k. I still can't drive a Cayman GT4 as well as a FR car because I'm not good at controlling MR driving dynamics yet (snap oversteer all day err day). In addition all tracks are scanned with elevation so characteristics of how the car adjusts with the track is there too.

Besides the lack of Gforce I would say the sim manages the car and track part of tracking very well. Plus, I can practice weak areas and not worry about over driving vs irl I could never do more than 7/10.
What I've noticed with MR cars is you have to do all your braking and downshifting before the turn and when the wheels are straight. I've noticed if the throttle position dips below ~10% during the turn, it induces snap oversteer. Try rolling into the throttle progressively (from 1/8-1/4 throttle position) once you're entering the apex. Either way you definitely have to use the throttle for stability more than you would in an FR car. I play with a controller, so it's a lot more finicky if you don't get it right. Needless to say my accelerator finger is shot after a few laps.

I'm using Forza 7 BTW (TCS off, ABS off, STM off, and manual shifting) not sure if it'll help with Assetto Corsa, but the concepts should be the same. The Ferrari 360 challenge stradale is the most forgiving and educational for getting comfortable with the dynamics of a MR car. Good luck man👍🏽

*And I agree, even in Forza the GT4 is not a very forgiving car like the 360CS.
Appreciate 0
      05-11-2020, 10:05 AM   #21
Resjudicata
Colonel
Resjudicata's Avatar
United_States
1598
Rep
2,935
Posts

Drives: M850i convertible
Join Date: Jun 2019
Location: Dulles Virginia

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by hsb View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by M3GymNut View Post
For those of you that track or drive professionally and have a sim rig...how close are the simulations from the real deal? Please be specific if possible I've always been curious.
I don't have an expensive rig but IMHO it's never going to be nowhere near the real thing. You don't have the g forces acting on you during cornering, braking, accelerating. The screen is just 2-dimensional so depth is hard to judge.
Buy a Miata and go to your local track and try, the real thing is so much more fun. With that said, it's convenient to be able to get your racing fix at home for just a few hours per day.
it's also a fraction of the cost. even a high end full computer rig is like 1/10th the price of a track day.
Appreciate 0
      05-11-2020, 11:23 AM   #22
izzyM2
Major
izzyM2's Avatar
619
Rep
1,199
Posts

Drives: 24’M2/21ID.4/21’MacanGTS
Join Date: Sep 2012
Location: SoCal

iTrader: (4)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Nalen View Post
Nice. I have the F1-GT cockpit from Next Level Racing. Its the previous version of the FGT one you have. For a belt based wheel base (I'm using Fanatec Clubsport V2.5), its fairly rigid. However, going to a direct drive system, I've read reviews that it introduces noticeable play.

Here's my setup! Recently just purchased the Samsung Odyssey Plus VR headset. Haven't had time to play around with it yet, but hoping its worth the purchase.
Your F1GT does not have a mount under the seat?
or did you intentionally place the buttkicker behind you.

Great setup, maybe I'll go fanatic when I move to a "real" sim software from GT Sport in the future but can't justify the cost at the moment.
Appreciate 0
Post Reply

Bookmarks

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 03:44 AM.




5post
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, vBulletin Solutions Inc.
1Addicts.com, BIMMERPOST.com, E90Post.com, F30Post.com, M3Post.com, ZPost.com, 5Post.com, 6Post.com, 7Post.com, XBimmers.com logo and trademark are properties of BIMMERPOST