[Red Bread]

Originally Posted by VisualEcho

I get that there are some better than others, I just don't get the hate because it's fake. So fucking what if it's fake, is real fire/fuel/air/pipe something special?

Give me that Ferrari sound out of my speakers any damn day of the week and I won't care what the hell the car sounds like for "spectators."

And this is how Tesla wins.

[chassis]

Another for the list- plastic wheel arches.

BMW has them on the X vehicles. MB has them on the GL vehicles, and is slipping them into the Allroad E-Class wagon.

Cheap and, well, plasticky. Most egregious on a white vehicle with base trim, which means black plastic wheel arches. Looks like a 2012 Subaru Crosstrek XV.

[GenXer]

These trends must die!

1. Gloss black panels
2. Touch screen controls without redundant physical buttons
3. Over sized wheel with low profile tires -- Anything above 20" is insane
4. Electronic touch screen vent direction. (I'm looking at your Porsche and Tesla!)
5. Fix-a-flat instead of a spare tire/wheel

[VisualEcho]

Originally Posted by GenXer

These trends must die!

3. Over sized wheel with low profile tires -- Anything above 20" is insane
5. Fix-a-flat instead of a spare tire/wheel

Cars are always getting bigger, but they should still have 17" wheels? Also, performance is increasing, which creates a need for big brakes, so the wheels much get larger.

Most people nowdays won't change a tire, it's too dangerous and sometimes too involved (another down-side to huge wheels/tires for you). In fact, insurance polls suggest people overwhelmingly prefer assistance, hence the AAA type coverage availability with most insurance policies. AAA is still the best though, as it doesn't count against you to use it, like it does with your insurance company.

[GenXer]

Originally Posted by VisualEcho

Cars are always getting bigger, but they should still have 17" wheels? Also, performance is increasing, which creates a need for big brakes, so the wheels much get larger.

Most people nowdays won't change a tire, it's too dangerous and sometimes too involved (another down-side to huge wheels/tires for you). In fact, insurance polls suggest people overwhelmingly prefer assistance, hence the AAA type coverage availability with most insurance policies. AAA is still the best though, as it doesn't count against you to use it, like it does with your insurance company.

17" wheels are too small as I said over 20" but they're coming out with 28" wheels and beyond.

I have AAA and have waited 2 hours for a tow truck since my 2012 NC Miata didn't come with a spare wheel and I was out in the middle of nowhere. It would have taken less than 20 minutes to mount a spare tire.

[cfm56d7b]

Originally Posted by GenXer

These trends must die!

1. Gloss black panels
2. Touch screen controls without redundant physical buttons
3. Over sized wheel with low profile tires -- Anything above 20" is insane
4. Electronic touch screen vent direction. (I'm looking at your Porsche and Tesla!)
5. Fix-a-flat instead of a spare tire/wheel

I second the motion for Items #2 and #4. Considering how touch only controls can distract the driver, one can only question the final approval process ...

[VisualEcho]

Originally Posted by GenXer

17" wheels are too small as I said over 20" but they're coming out with 28" wheels and beyond.

I have AAA and have waited 2 hours for a tow truck since my 2012 NC Miata didn't come with a spare wheel and I was out in the middle of nowhere. It would have taken less than 20 minutes to mount a spare tire.

Unless the vehicle is extremely large, then yeah, I absolutely agree that above 22 is out of the question. Even 20" is insane to me, but I understand on certain cars. Weird thing is that you've got some relatively small cars, like the Corvette, with 20's.

Hard to fit a spare in a Miata, no?

But if it's important to you to not wait, just pick one up. That's what I did for my work car, bought a full size spare, and keep real tools in it as well, then there's no worries.

[RM7]

Originally Posted by VisualEcho

Unless the vehicle is extremely large, then yeah, I absolutely agree that above 22 is out of the question. Even 20" is insane to me, but I understand on certain cars. Weird thing is that you've got some relatively small cars, like the Corvette, with 20's.

Hard to fit a spare in a Miata, no?

But if it's important to you to not wait, just pick one up. That's what I did for my work car, bought a full size spare, and keep real tools in it as well, then there's no worries.

It’s a balance of traction and gyroscopic forces/acceleration, bigger wheels can give more traction, contact patch (no, not the ideal non-deformation solid wheel concept) and so on, but smaller wheels change direction and accelerate easier. So if you can make the big wheels light or compensate with a lot of power...or maybe it’s the power that requires them, it can work, but it’s usually obvious when this was a design consideration vs just dumb big wheels (that let dinky brakes show through)? IMO, you want the smallest wheels that clear the brakes and provide enough traction. Often, on earlier dodges and mustangs, the primary issue was the width, 400+hp vehicles should not be equipped with 255 tires in any situation. So you go wider if possible and only bigger diameter if necessary.

[Mingwan]

I’m surprised no one mentioned the ever increasing size of vehicles generation after generation.

I believe this will change in the near future. There will paradigm shift towards reducing the size of vehicles.

[GenXer]

Originally Posted by VisualEcho

Unless the vehicle is extremely large, then yeah, I absolutely agree that above 22 is out of the question. Even 20" is insane to me, but I understand on certain cars. Weird thing is that you've got some relatively small cars, like the Corvette, with 20's.

Hard to fit a spare in a Miata, no?

But if it's important to you to not wait, just pick one up. That's what I did for my work car, bought a full size spare, and keep real tools in it as well, then there's no worries.

There's no room in a Miata's trunk for a spare. Even a donut would take 1/2 of the space in the "trunk" It came with a can of fix-a-flat and I eventually got a set of run flats. (They don't ride any differently in a Miata)

I had a C7 Z51 Corvette. The wheels/tires were staggered 19" in front with 245/35-19 RFT and 20" rear with 285/30-20 RFT

But it had magnetic ride suspension so it was very comfortable.

[GenXer]

I waited 2 hours waiting for a tow. Fix-a-flat will not fix this.

[Moflow]

Originally Posted by GenXer

These trends must die!

1. Gloss black panels
2. Touch screen controls without redundant physical buttons
3. Over sized wheel with low profile tires -- Anything above 20" is insane
4. Electronic touch screen vent direction. (I'm looking at your Porsche and Tesla!)
5. Fix-a-flat instead of a spare tire/wheel

That's a good list. I agree with you on the oversize wheels. I get that they're necessary for big brakes, but I really miss having sidewall. Mostly for the durability over potholes and stuff, but also for the ride, and if i'm being honest, the look. Chunky tires can look cool if you do them right, like an old race car.

[RM7]

Originally Posted by GenXer

I waited 2 hours waiting for a tow. Fix-a-flat will not fix this.

A plug might, especially a plug plus some fix-a-flat to get to a reasonable place to get a new tire.

[Red Bread]

Originally Posted by Mingwan

I’m surprised no one mentioned the ever increasing size of vehicles generation after generation.

I believe this will change in the near future. There will paradigm shift towards reducing the size of vehicles.

Why do you think that? Will people get smaller? If gas is cheap and fast food is cheap and everywhere, cars will just keep getting larger.

[Smgs1992]

Originally Posted by JamesNoBrakes

A plug might, especially a plug plus some fix-a-flat to get to a reasonable place to get a new tire.

Plug won't fix that it's too close to the sidewall and any legitimate tire shop will tell you that is unsafe to plug given its location.

[Red Bread]

Originally Posted by Smgs1992

Plug won't fix that it's too close to the sidewall and any legitimate tire shop will tell you that is unsafe to plug given its location.

He's saying a plug and fix a flat would allow you to get to the tire shop and get a new tire. That tire is toast, so why not try the plug plus goo?

[SteveinArizona]

Originally Posted by Drv4fun

M8 with eco pro

Is there such a thing?

[stein_325i]

Originally Posted by tayone415

Manufacturers, will never be able to please 100% of all consumers, as you two show having opposite opinions of. Having had cars with bad cabin insulation in addition to under the hood and exhaust noise gets annoying especially at highway speeds, I would like a quiet cabin free from outside now. If I wanted to hear engine or exhaust sounds, I feel like rolling down the windows would be a better option IMO.

If some owners are happy with fake engine sounds, then BMW did their job to please those specific customers. I think part of the reason why some people don't like it, is because they prefer to hear the engine or exhaust naturally. Yes, there are many people who want other people to hear their cars as a way to show off, but there are also other people who just love hearing the sound their car makes.

Simple solution would be to offer an "off" mode similar to Toyota or Hyundai.

[VisualEcho]

Originally Posted by tayone415

I would like a quiet cabin free from outside now.

You bought the wrong car. Could I interest you in a Lexus?

[yco]

i can understand eco pro on M8.. it can be useful on long trips besides most of the buyers wont be that "enthusiastic" probably or wannabes.. but there is one thing i hate about new cars and its overweight.. yes there are some needs and stuff.. but overweight is the killing factor for all cars.. except GT-R though..

[RM7]

Originally Posted by Smgs1992

Plug won't fix that it's too close to the sidewall and any legitimate tire shop will tell you that is unsafe to plug given its location.

I just mean to get it to a shop. Plug kits are dead simple to use.

[Red Bread]

Isn't there a BMW OBD tool like OBDEleven? I've turned the SoundAktor off in both our VW and Audi.