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      10-03-2016, 05:50 AM   #111
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SCOTT26
Quote:
Originally Posted by Alpine535Msport View Post
Good luck keeping that up. You can rest on your laurels for only so long. The lack of winning comparison tests, the 5-series no longer being on Car and Drivers 10 best list as the E39 did for all of its production, shows that BMWs direction has changed and upper management doesn't seem to care. The E39 and E38 were amazing cars, where as the new 7 and the current 5 are just blah to drive.
We initiated a research project to determine whether people actually use car reviews to purchase cars. Thankfully they do not. Because as above winning comparisons do not matter. When you win more prestigious awards in relation to your business. BMW again crowned worlds most green manufacturer then a wider majority of people take attention.

Comparison tests to my self and others do not matter especially when driven by a "personality" and especially when a sneezing panda could do a better job and gain a wider audience. Today comparison tests are driven by advertising more than marketing. Which is why BMW do a lot of internal advertising especially by launching the new 5er as the key car in the return of the next cycle of BMW Films series.

In regards to no one cares?
BMW like other businesses have to adapt to an ever changing industry, therefore technology and drivetrain technology are very much at the forefront now of how cars are developed. Drivers habits change as does preference. The 5er might be called a mini 7er but what's starts at the top filters downwards in regard to the expectant customer who wants those features. The F10 is still the best in its class as the business class mid-level sedan. Its success is down entirely to be all things competent as does the 3er. Our key volume markets are driven by the need to be competent in those segments.

The new 5er and its ability to remain competent is very much apparent. It has a wide range of abilities to keep the car at the forefront of today's requirements.
Whether you are a driver,gadget admirer or even someone that uses the car for the long distance business trips city to city via the Autobahn. Then the 5er will be the car you expect it to be in every guise from the 520d to the 540i even the 540e. Of course performance will not be ignored in the M550,M550d,M550e and of course the all new M5. And depending on where you are in the world? A new 5er Touring.

The new 7er is no way blah to drive. Its very dynamic, direct and the aid of the Carbon Core makes the car feel smaller than it is. In an S-Klasse the weight becomes apparent. It might not have the S-Klasses refinement. But BMW want owners to drive the 7er not rejuvenate in the back.
Of course some people use comparison reviews to help the purchase process. Buyers will look at reviews on reliability some might be influenced by write ups on green credentials. Others might be influenced by what certain test drivers say. In the U.K people like Chris Harris have an influence in the performance car sector etc etc

Others will be influenced by social media especially when looking for the best finance etc


Always a worry when corporate people are so defensive usually means the business is under pressure and not in listening mode !
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      10-03-2016, 07:32 AM   #112
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Alpine535Msport View Post
like me and most people I know who are into BMW's 95% agree that the E60 wasn't one of BMW's best designs.
Design was, is and will be subjective, but nobody can't deny that the E60 successfully migrated a lot of customers from other brands and it's not the only example, most cars from "Bangle era" did the same.

Working in this industry and I understand how "design" works, allow me to tell you, BMW is ahead of time with it's designs and technology which makes these designs in real life.

Stop judging cars based on some speculative rendering.
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      10-03-2016, 07:57 AM   #113
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Danyutz
Quote:
Originally Posted by Alpine535Msport View Post
like me and most people I know who are into BMW's 95% agree that the E60 wasn't one of BMW's best designs.
Design was, is and will be subjective, but nobody can't deny that the E60 successfully migrated a lot of customers from other brands and it's not the only example, most cars from "Bangle era" did the same.

Working in this industry and I understand how "design" works, allow me to tell you, BMW is ahead of time with it's designs and technology which makes these designs in real life.

Stop judging cars based on some speculative rendering.
The E60 was successful because BMW had already built years of reputation with cars such as the E34, E36, E39, E38, etc etc. BMW during those times were ahead of the game by a lot. Now a days they're just equal to cars in its segment and even beaten by some at most times. Take for example the new Jaguar XE and XF. In terms of ride, handling, and steering they're better than competitive 3 and 5 series models. BMW still the ultimate driving machine, I think not.
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      10-03-2016, 09:29 AM   #114
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lexxeech View Post
Hello there,

Yesterday I've attended the closed-door presentation of the new 5er, the G30. Allow me to share my experience with you guys.

First thing I'd like to point out is that no cell phones were allowed, therefore I won't be able to share any real-life photos of the G30 with you today. The presentation itself was held in Riga (Latvia) throughout two days, with small groups of people being invited at the interval of 2 hours.

At first we were greeted with a short introduction to the 5 series history, sales numbers, and some other facts, followed by some teasers, and then they finally unveiled the wraps off this beast.

We've had a 540i with M-Sport package installed on show. Color was some new shade of silver, and a lot of options were ticked and on display. I've been rather skeptical about the new 5er, especially after seeing the updated E-Klasse's interior, which looked like a scaled down S-Klasse. Well, here I am, happy to report that 5er's interior is sort of baby 7er without the chrome nonsense.

But first things first. The front. The render below is 100% accurate representation of production car with M-Sport package (I think we've even had the same 20" wheels on our unit):

Attachment 1501662


There are no nonsense LED lights like on the 7er, everything is extremely aggressive, balanced. I've noticed how the hood was going as a single piece all until the headlights without that previous generation pedestrian safety cut-out line. They've shown us active air vents (the grills), I guess they come as standard now. I've also heard that they will ditch xenon lights altogether and instead offer either halogen as standard or LED as an option (this could vary in different markets). Oh, and car alarm will be standard. Yippie!

Car's profile (also seen in the render) was rather balanced, great-looking. The rear is something that I could not find the proper render of. It had something of 7er, but without that awful rear chrome line. Overall taillights looked awesome, there was a power trunk button present (not sure if that's been on F10). The car is said to be 100kg lighter thanks to the new OKL platform and use of carbon fiber (but you knew that already).

Now the interior was on par with 7 series. Our sample even hard the rear infotainment system, same as 7er. Ambient lighting was present as well, and new top of the line audio system will come from Bowers & Wilkens. I've heard talks of M550d and M550i (!!) models coming up in the near future (first production cars should roll out around February, so I guess M Performance models will come around Summer), and there was a mention of 4 turbos . I've also heard some bits about MXXX cars featuring quad pipes, just like the true M cars. Sure hope it's just a rumor. Speaking of the M car, again, with a grain of salt, but there was a rumor talk of having two versions (RWD/AWD), with AWD actually being the superior performance model.

iDrive (all them gestures and touch screen stuff) and instrument cluster were basically taken out of G11 and put into G30. I guess it's a good thing. I noticed that the center-console has been more driver-oriented than before.

I believe you already know that that advanced key fob from 7er is also coming to the 5er, carrying all those options, such as remote parking.

Overall, I came out impressed and satisfied with what I saw. This will be a solid car that a lot of people will like. They took what made 7er cool, improved the styling (I just hate those "aftermarket" looking LEDs on the front), and upgraded the interior. This is all I care about, really.

I believe World Premiere will be around Paris Autoshow, so there's not much time left for you all to see the actual car.
Did they say anything on electrification?
Timing of plug in hybrid version?
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      10-03-2016, 01:08 PM   #115
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Not a fan of the way the M looks, and I always go for the M sport version

I hope in flesh the car looks better, while not a surprise with all the spy photos, the dashboard copy of the 7 is simply another bad news, don't like the disconnection between the center console and the upper side, the 7 design fit the purpose for what the 7 buyers are after luxury and comfort, replicating the design on the 5 suppose to be on the sporty side is simply not on let along the Audi way of doing cars copy and pace and change the size!
This time around I pray the car in flesh will shift my thought, just like with the E60 and F10.

Last edited by martin mustang; 10-03-2016 at 01:16 PM..
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      10-03-2016, 05:37 PM   #116
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Quote:
Originally Posted by remmib
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Originally Posted by ManiacGT View Post
Dropping Xenon for standard Halogen? Surely you mean the other way around!
Quote:
Originally Posted by clbmw View Post
Likewise, seriously hope that was a mistake.

Even the guys at my local dealership have said (quietly) they cannot believe BMW are selling premium cars in 2016 with halogen bulbs. They described their night driving experiences of them in a very unflattering way.

Big mistake if it's true, especially being as the current 4er is xenon as standard.
You now get LED headlights instead of Xenon, just like on the F30 LCI.
G030,31,32, and F090 do not have halogen in the SALPA equipment build list for ECE both LHD and RHD, and US Type. LED, Adaptive LED, and Icon Adaptive Full LED is all that appears. Xenon will be eliminated completely within a few years from every model line during LCI or new series variant changeover.
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      10-03-2016, 06:04 PM   #117
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Quote:
Originally Posted by matbl
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lexxeech View Post
Hello there,

Yesterday I've attended the closed-door presentation of the new 5er, the G30. Allow me to share my experience with you guys.

First thing I'd like to point out is that no cell phones were allowed, therefore I won't be able to share any real-life photos of the G30 with you today. The presentation itself was held in Riga (Latvia) throughout two days, with small groups of people being invited at the interval of 2 hours.

At first we were greeted with a short introduction to the 5 series history, sales numbers, and some other facts, followed by some teasers, and then they finally unveiled the wraps off this beast.

We've had a 540i with M-Sport package installed on show. Color was some new shade of silver, and a lot of options were ticked and on display. I've been rather skeptical about the new 5er, especially after seeing the updated E-Klasse's interior, which looked like a scaled down S-Klasse. Well, here I am, happy to report that 5er's interior is sort of baby 7er without the chrome nonsense.

But first things first. The front. The render below is 100% accurate representation of production car with M-Sport package (I think we've even had the same 20" wheels on our unit):

Attachment 1501662


There are no nonsense LED lights like on the 7er, everything is extremely aggressive, balanced. I've noticed how the hood was going as a single piece all until the headlights without that previous generation pedestrian safety cut-out line. They've shown us active air vents (the grills), I guess they come as standard now. I've also heard that they will ditch xenon lights altogether and instead offer either halogen as standard or LED as an option (this could vary in different markets). Oh, and car alarm will be standard. Yippie!

Car's profile (also seen in the render) was rather balanced, great-looking. The rear is something that I could not find the proper render of. It had something of 7er, but without that awful rear chrome line. Overall taillights looked awesome, there was a power trunk button present (not sure if that's been on F10). The car is said to be 100kg lighter thanks to the new OKL platform and use of carbon fiber (but you knew that already).

Now the interior was on par with 7 series. Our sample even hard the rear infotainment system, same as 7er. Ambient lighting was present as well, and new top of the line audio system will come from Bowers & Wilkens. I've heard talks of M550d and M550i (!!) models coming up in the near future (first production cars should roll out around February, so I guess M Performance models will come around Summer), and there was a mention of 4 turbos . I've also heard some bits about MXXX cars featuring quad pipes, just like the true M cars. Sure hope it's just a rumor. Speaking of the M car, again, with a grain of salt, but there was a rumor talk of having two versions (RWD/AWD), with AWD actually being the superior performance model.

iDrive (all them gestures and touch screen stuff) and instrument cluster were basically taken out of G11 and put into G30. I guess it's a good thing. I noticed that the center-console has been more driver-oriented than before.

I believe you already know that that advanced key fob from 7er is also coming to the 5er, carrying all those options, such as remote parking.

Overall, I came out impressed and satisfied with what I saw. This will be a solid car that a lot of people will like. They took what made 7er cool, improved the styling (I just hate those "aftermarket" looking LEDs on the front), and upgraded the interior. This is all I care about, really.

I believe World Premiere will be around Paris Autoshow, so there's not much time left for you all to see the actual car.
Did they say anything on electrification?
Timing of plug in hybrid version?
Yeh, they said, we're not doing that, it's a shit load of nonsense that nobody wants......

We will be beefing up our 4, 6 and 8 cylinder models accordingly to ensure we maintain the joy for all our customers....
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      10-04-2016, 11:45 AM   #118
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lemetier View Post
G030,31,32, and F090 do not have halogen in the SALPA equipment build list for ECE both LHD and RHD, and US Type. LED, Adaptive LED, and Icon Adaptive Full LED is all that appears. Xenon will be eliminated completely within a few years from every model line during LCI or new series variant changeover.
So these are not halogen, but so kind of LED?

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      10-04-2016, 12:54 PM   #119
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Looks like an Infinity M45.
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      10-04-2016, 02:04 PM   #120
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Quote:
Originally Posted by remmib
Quote:
Originally Posted by lemetier View Post
G030,31,32, and F090 do not have halogen in the SALPA equipment build list for ECE both LHD and RHD, and US Type. LED, Adaptive LED, and Icon Adaptive Full LED is all that appears. Xenon will be eliminated completely within a few years from every model line during LCI or new series variant changeover.
So these are not halogen, but so kind of LED?

[IMG]http://g30.bimmerpost.com/goodiesfor...brid%20008.jpg[/IMG]
They are LED Headlight. The indicators are halogen however. Only Icon have LED indicators.
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      10-04-2016, 03:03 PM   #121
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What's the black surround on the windscreen? Is that part of the camouflage or normal. My F10 I don't think has that much of a border on it.
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      10-04-2016, 04:31 PM   #122
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What's the black surround on the windscreen? Is that part of the camouflage or normal. My F10 I don't think has that much of a border on it.
I think that my be normal. The F10 might not have that much, but it does have some. It won't actually affect vision though I don't think; I've never noticed it on mine.

It does seem from this spy shot that it will have two cameras at the top (for 3D?) for semi-autonomous driving. Versus the one camera currently on the F10.
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      10-04-2016, 09:03 PM   #123
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Originally Posted by cc3 View Post
Of course some people use comparison reviews to help the purchase process. Buyers will look at reviews on reliability some might be influenced by write ups on green credentials. Others might be influenced by what certain test drivers say. In the U.K people like Chris Harris have an influence in the performance car sector etc etc

Others will be influenced by social media especially when looking for the best finance etc


Always a worry when corporate people are so defensive usually means the business is under pressure and not in listening mode !
Scott refers to the generic buyers, we're not. Probably Nobody in this forum is. It is the 30 something blonde dropping here kids at school with the 218d or X1 20i. We're a niche that have to move out to a porsche panamera. I can't, since I don't want to (can't) spend the cash for a simple few miles a day commute. So in your absence, I'll discuss further with Scott.

I' am not pleased how BMW seems to distance itself continuously from its own plethora of asceticism, which was, remind me... driving dynamics. There was a time when BMW preached to the world that balance, composure and control where holly and not to be compromised, what ever.

"BMW will never do turbo since it's crap."
"M will always be manual".
"BMW will never do diesel".
"BMW will not go into suv".
"BMW is loyal to RWD".

lol, what a joke!

I guess, that marketing and time proved that all this was pure mumbo jumbo and make believe. All this being said, I still will probably aim for a G30 next year, and not the Audi nor Merc since the BMW will still eclipse them in the vehicle dynamics department.
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      10-05-2016, 02:19 PM   #124
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SCOTT26 View Post
Today comparison tests are driven by advertising more than marketing.
I'm a car journalist. I challenge you to prove this bullshit.
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      10-05-2016, 06:55 PM   #125
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Originally Posted by snipe View Post
I'm a car journalist. I challenge you to prove this bullshit.
Seems total none sense to me also. No proof of this assumption possible though, just a wild idea that pops up every time a new release receives a luke warm welcoming of the press. Maybe I'am naive but I believe what I read about a car. I believe it's the honest reflection of the journalist (which is partially subjective and biased of course).

Certainly, the MKT departments of a brand would like to eliminate the press, since that opens the way for them to sell turds for gold to the wide public.

Thank God we still have press to keep the manufactures focussed on delivery.

Last edited by KoenG; 10-05-2016 at 07:06 PM..
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      10-06-2016, 11:24 AM   #126
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Originally Posted by KoenG View Post
I guess, that marketing and time proved that all this was pure mumbo jumbo and make believe. All this being said, I still will probably aim for a G30 next year, and not the Audi nor Merc since the BMW will still eclipse them in the vehicle dynamics department.
The lesson here is to not get too sentimental about a product produced for profit by a corporation, unless perhaps you're a cousin of the Quandts. It's tough, as BMW honed its product experience into a cult as effectively as Apple, even as the gap between these and lesser brands narrows. I mean, I came out of the BMW Museum - their best marketing tool - feeling a part of the brand's 100 years of performance and technology, giddy to return and pick up my next BMW. But alas it is a just a product that happens to suit my tastes a bit better than its competitors. Anyway, off to go pick up an iPhone 7. . .
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      10-10-2016, 05:22 PM   #127
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Quote:
Originally Posted by snipe View Post
I'm a car journalist. I challenge you to prove this bullshit.
lol...the irony is that Advertising is a marketing element and shouldn't be treated as a separate function as it is driven by marketing.
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      10-11-2016, 08:08 AM   #128
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Seen the car this weekend during our closed room event.

People that expect an revolutionary design will be very unimpressed, because the car bears an evolutionary design. It looks fresh, suits the new 5 series.

It looks like a G11, but a lot more compact, with beautiful lines and design cues, suitable for the G30.

Interior has been even more refined, with most of the goodies ported from the G11, with some extra as well.
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      10-11-2016, 08:46 AM   #129
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Inablur View Post
lol...the irony is that Advertising is a marketing element and shouldn't be treated as a separate function as it is driven by marketing.
He didn't quite get that, now did he?
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