[Drop the hammer]

So I am a happy M2 owner. Really like the car (my second m2 after an m3). Anyways I’m getting bored (I’m tuned and full bolt on’s, but wanting a bit more) was thinking of getting a replacement car. I have garage space for it full time, just putting into context. I do all my own work on the cars. Kind of a hobbiest. Was thinking McLaren 650s (since it would be a lot of issues to constantly work on). Or late teens 2018’ish 911 Turbo S coupe or maybe a gt3 if I can find one in that price range. It would only be a Sunday driver and low miles annually. Budget is 200k’ish Canadian, so around 150k US. I’m not sure what I should get. Go with the reliable turbo S or go with the full time hobby 650s. I do like wrenching and such. 2 very different cars. Also would consider other cars.
Car use would be spirited canyon drives with buddies, wash and wax on Sundays, and really just oogling it daily in the garage, that’s about it. Maybe occasional date night w dear wife.

[dgoldenz]

If you don't have a McLaren dealer or indy shop nearby I wouldn't get one. You may be good at wrenching but there's certain things that can only be done with special diagnostic tools that only dealers and some indy shops have. Aston Martin doesn't even let indy shops have them, ask me how I know! Parts can also be absurdly expensive and difficult to get if anything big breaks. Owning any exotic without a good dealer/indy shop nearby is a recipe for a not-so-fun ownership experience if you get unlucky and have some issues.

Can never go wrong with a GT3. Personally I'd take a 991.1 GTS over a Turbo S, both great cars but I'm a NA engine kind of guy. The GTS will be a lot cheaper too and just as fun IMO. 718 GTS 4.0 or Spyder/GT4 are also obvious candidates.

Ferrari F430 and FF are in your price range. The V12 in the FF is mind-blowingly awesome. If you're really good at wrenching and can do your own engine-out services, the F355 with a manual would be a hell of a lot of fun and IMO is one of best looking Ferraris ever made.

[P1]

I'd get a 911. I don't even care which one. Just a 911.

[pbonsalb]

I would go with the 991.2 or 992.1 911 Turbo. Still very complex, but parts will be much cheaper than the McLaren, it is much more practical, and there is more aftermarket support and mods. The forums are likely more active, also.

Personally, I would take the Turbo over the Turbo S. I am a modder so that leaves more money for mods and 911 Turbo mods are expensive. I am also not sure I want carbon fiber rotors due to the potential for damage and high replacement cost and I don't really want monoblock wheels. You need a 600+ lb torque wrench for those. But I drive my cars and you say you would not drive much so maybe my concerns are different from yours.

Likewise, the Turbo is great for everyday driveability and performance. The GT3 is certainly edgier, but it is more involved to drive and a little less straightline performance though still more than enough for most people. There is a Touring version, at least currently, that might make it more of a driver. But again, I am interested in a year round driver and you may prefer a rarely driven exotic toy.

I had an E90 M3 for 10 years that I modded. Certainly no comparison to the GT3, but I did get to experience a high revving naturally aspirated motor in a fairly high state of tune. Mine was modded and probably made about 400 rwhp and ran to 8600 rpm. It was thrilling from 5500-8500 but if you did a long pull in a gear from say 3000 rpm, you were waiting a while for the fun to begin. I had the 6MT so I had to work hard to keep it on boil if that was my goal. The DCT would probably have been the better choice for me.

When I was looking for a newer car in 2021, it was either a 991.2 911 Turbo or Turbo S or an F90 M5. I nearly bought a 911 Turbo and nearly a Turbo S. The Porsche would have been a better investment -- they skyrocketed since the beginning of 2021. But I am actually happy I bought the M5 because I have driven it a lot more than I would have driven the Porsche because it is more practical and holds more stuff. I can go to Home Depot, pack tools for maintenance work, carry the dogs and stuff. Not getting a 2x4 in the Porsche. And it is a comfortable cruiser -- with ridiculous straightline performance. Both would be nice so I will probably add the Porsche in the next year or two.

[x622]

Absolutely DO NOT get a 992 turbo s. Boring as hell. 991.2? Sure. 992? No.

Do NOT get a 650s unless you can manage to get your hands on a proper mclaren scantool. There's clones that you can buy, but like others have said unless you have access to this tooling you're not gonna be able to do it.

Have you considered;
Older lotus exige
Viper


Also to the guy above me, you know you can just use a long torque bar right? They have an arrow to point where to torque it to.

[pbonsalb]

To the guy above me — Yes, I understand leverage. But I still would not choose mono blocks. I like simplicity.

Viper — no AWD to put the big power down.

Lotus Elige — Camry engine albeit with an aftermarket supercharger and a cabin with less usefulness than just about anything else.

992 vs 991 — Aren’t all cars losing road feel over time? Do you want a 1960s car with rack and pinion, AM radio, and roll up windows? You’ll feel everything…. 992 outruns the 991 on the street or in the track, Turbo or GT3.

I’d guess the OP would be happiest with a 991 GT3 — foreign enough, exotic enough, rare enough, fast enough. But is it driveable enough? Or is he going to be in it for only 2 hours in sunny Sundays in summer so that doesn’t matter?

[x622]

Originally Posted by pbonsalb

To the guy above me — Yes, I understand leverage. But I still would not choose mono blocks. I like simplicity.

Viper — no AWD to put the big power down.

Lotus Elige — Camry engine albeit with an aftermarket supercharger and a cabin with less usefulness than just about anything else.

992 vs 991 — Aren’t all cars losing road feel over time? Do you want a 1960s car with rack and pinion, AM radio, and roll up windows? You’ll feel everything…. 992 outruns the 991 on the street or in the track, Turbo or GT3.

I’d guess the OP would be happiest with a 991 GT3 — foreign enough, exotic enough, rare enough, fast enough. But is it driveable enough? Or is he going to be in it for only 2 hours in sunny Sundays in summer so that doesn’t matter?

One lug with a torque arrow versus 5 lugs to shimmy on.


Viper would be a fun car. It puts down the power just fine. So do the Mclarens.. They're also RWD.

Exige comes with a 2zz from the toyotas, I personally like the way they drive than the Evoras with have the 3.5L v6. OP seems like a drivers car kinda guy, and this is it.

I think you are being disingenuous about how boring the 992 really is. It's bigger, heavier and much softer as a car than the 991.2 was, and yes, sure it's faster but speed isn't everything. Again, this ties back to the OP seeming like a genuine car guy who values steering feel, chassis communication and engine sound. I'd also say the 992 TTS sounded like absolute ass. Even with an akrapovic exhaust. The GT3 cars fare better, but the noise is awful. It sounded like a literal boat.

I agree with you on the 991.2 GT3, if possible RS. Fantastic little drivers car, turns great, feels great and won't lose you any value. It's not "FAST" in the straights.

[dgoldenz]

FWIW I had a 992 GTS coupe and a 991.1 GTS cab at the same time and preferred the 991 especially considering the $60k price difference. The 992 was almost too good, too fast, too smooth. The 991 has a more raw feel to it. No brainer to me considering the price delta. I might change my mind if they make a 992 GTS with NA engine.

[Davil]

I think the want a bit more is the tell. You should probably buy a McLaren if that’s what you are after. Nothing will come close if you are one of those guys that want to strap a rocket to your bottom and fly to the moon.

I’m way more about an older analogue style of driving. I don’t want to race people. I like the therapy of naturally aspirated power and the overall analogue experience of days gone by. I don’t want to quote measurements as I’m happy with mine.

It just comes down to what floats your boat.

It’s nothing modern for me. For the Porsche fanatics, the 911 died at 997 as an engaging car.

[M5Rick]

Forget the cash guzzlers and go one up, you'll be far happier with a good used V8 M3.

[Alfisti]

997.2 GT3 is the answer. Before cars got all fancy pants.

[pbonsalb]

Originally Posted by M5Rick

Forget the cash guzzlers and go one up, you'll be far happier with a good used V8 M3.

I had an E90 M3 for 10 years. Modded, of course. Great car and great value, but definitely noticeably short of any version GT3. If cost was a factor, I’d put it in the list, but the OP has a budget of $150k USD and wants a toy. After the M3, I was thinking that I wanted more, either a toy like a GT3 or 911 Turbo, or a fast AWD sedan like the E63 AMG, Panamerica Turbo or M5.

[Humdizzle]

get the best R8 v10 you can. rwd preferably.

if you want a manual there is the 997.2 GT3 or Viper. Probably not as easy to find those in Canada though.

i would absolutely NOT do a mclaren unless you get an extended warranty and have a dealer nearby.

[Alfisti]

There's a .2 GT3 right in his back yard with arguably the perfect mileage. Price likely negotiable.

https://www.autotrader.ca/a/porsche/...%202N2&sprx=-1

I could be nuts, could be the lighting but the front bumper looks a different shade of white. The build is great, interior is really nice and 45KM means driver not shop or garage queen. Price will just keep rising on these .2 cars, many see them as the last of analog 911's.

EDIT: Checked the carfax, she has had a small front end impact so my eye may be right. One to inspect in person.

Otherwise, at this price point, I could go a Lotus Emira or Exige with lots of options ticked. There's a member here with the mother of all Exige builds and it looks like sex.

[Josh-PA]

https://www.6speedonline.com/forums/...d-6-speed.html

[///MPhatic]

A FBO M2 is hard to beat for fun, reliability, sound, power, DIY, parts prices, and overall cost, which is why I still have mine 5 years on. There are some decent prospects at $150K; R8, 911, NSX, but for me it'd take $200K to make the change (Ferrari 458 in a decent spec with decent miles). Good luck with your search, it's a fun time, but it's going to take a lot of searching to find something really worth the difference in price, and even then you'll be hard pressed to find something as fun (that you're not so worried about hurting).

And to everyone that suggested a Viper, good lord, why are you even here? lol

I'd walk first.

[Alfisti]

I've got issues with exotics, attract too much attention.

[Alfisti]

$80K USD is about $130K imported into Canada, all fees and taxes, call it 135 with PPI and shipping.

https://www.cars.com/vehicledetail/f...-5b8e36a1dbdf/

It's a proper drivers car. $65K in your pocket to keep the wife occupied whilst you drive the car.

[Josh-PA]

here is a nice look 997 GT3 in Vancouver:
https://www.6speedonline.com/forums/...27k-miles.html

[Alfisti]

That's a .1 but fuck me it's gorgeous.

[Drop the hammer]

Really good info. I love the McLaren looks and pedigree, but yes for same money I can get a gt3 or turbo and drive it alot more, and not worry about codes and gremlins interrupting a mtn drive.
I do track my cars sometimes (couple times a year). I would never take a McLaren to the track. But I would take a 911. I’d probably be able to drive a 911 more often and get a bit more utility out of it, although utility is not needed at all for this car (other cars in the stable). I have driven a few R8’s and they didn’t really excite me, both were awd).
Thanks for all the info. I hadn’t thought of a gt3rs but I’d do see some of the 2016’s down in price now and closer to where I wanted to be for cost. Although I could stretch a bit on budget for the perfect car.
I’m also in no rush. Retirement in a year or two, and I’m also thinking waiting a bit longer would probably reveal more value on these range of cars.

[Drop the hammer]

Those 997’s look great. That black one is wonderful!