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      10-08-2014, 09:43 AM   #1
Tjalle
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Älgtest - Elk test- Moose test

The Swedish auto magazine Teknikens Värld (Google: teknikensvärld.se) has performed its - world famous- älgtest with X4, Macan and Evoque.

Both X4 and Evoque performed with no problems, while Macan had an unexpected behaviour - it locked left front wheel when trying to counter steer to the right in the elk avoidance test. According to the journalists it was scary. There is a film and also English text.

Porsche explains the action with the purpose to avoid a rollover situation.

I.e. there was a risk for a rollover in an accident avoidance manouver - unless Porsce did program a lock up on one of the front wheels.
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      10-08-2014, 10:08 AM   #2
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Interesting do you have the links to the video?
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      10-08-2014, 01:14 PM   #3
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inamik: easy, you just Google: teknikensvärld.se and scroll down to:älgtest. Film and English text. Since you are www, this is a good exercise.

To my mind this is a major blow to Porsche/Macan.

Teknikens Värld tested the MB A-class about 10 years ago with disatrous outcome and made MB redesign the chassis and add ESP to all A-class.
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      10-08-2014, 11:11 PM   #4
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Video, wierd for a Porsche definetly poor handling in an emergency situation
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      10-09-2014, 05:21 AM   #5
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Porsche response:
REPLY FROM PORSCHE

The brake intervention shown in the video is a deliberately applied intervention to prevent the car from rolling over. This is called Active Rollover Prevention (ARP). The precise, momentary application of brake force to the front wheel at the outside of the bend down to the low slip range minimises cornering forces to avoid critical or instable driving conditions such as oversteer, rollover or detachment of the tyre from the wheel. Situations such as these may not be controllable by the driver.

The video shows that an understeer response is selected on purpose since it is significantly easier for the driver to control than oversteer. The function shown and the resulting driving response are explicitly desired to increase driving safety in such a highly dynamic driving manoeuvre.

In the SUV segment, Active Rollover Prevention (ARP) is state-of-the-art technology and is also used by other vehicle manufacturers.

The intensity of ARP intervention is dependent on vehicle speed and steering angle speed, among others. This means that ARP brake intervention is diminished accordingly at reduced vehicle speed or steering angle speeds. On the other hand, it means that the driving style adopted by Teknikens Värld was very demanding and resulted in the safety function being triggered.

Active Rollover Prevention is permanently active, irrespective of whether Porsche Stability Management (PSM) is on or off. If PSM is on, ARP intervention is significantly diminished since PSM brake interventions to stabilise the vehicle occur much earlier or are superimposed.

The function (ARP) is applied for a maximum of 300 milliseconds, depending on the driving situation. This short intervention ensures the directional stability of the vehicle. Lateral displacement is negligible. For this reason we do not regard this driving state as critical. As the video shows, lane changing can be completed stably and safely. What is more critical in this situation is if the vehicle were to roll over or the rear were to break away. The vehicle demonstrated none of these instable states (rollover, oversteer, wheel lift) at any time.

Porsche uses a comprehensive dynamics test programme which the Macan completed successfully. The driving manoeuvres performed include double lane change according to ISO, slalom with 10 x 18 metres and 10 x 36 metres, the VDA obstacle avoidance test which is very similar to the Teknikens Värld ”moose test”, and the NHTSA rollover safety test. All Porsche cars are designed for maximum safety based on these and other world-wide tests.

Hermann-Josef Stappen, Porsche
http://www.macanforum.com/forum/maca...-elk-test.html
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      10-09-2014, 07:00 AM   #6
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i would say this is a fail and this so called safety feature is more dangerous than safe
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      10-09-2014, 07:55 AM   #7
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If I was to undertake an avoidance manoever and the car intervened with my driving - in this case preventing me from steering to the right, I would be scared and then pissed off. It is also potentially dangerous.

It is bad enough with ESP - in some cars - intervening when I am about to slide through a bend, but that just prevents me from having a bit of fun - here the system forces the vehicle in the opposite direction.

This is about the same as with A-class about 10 years ago- too aggressive chassis - including tires - for the center of gravity. MB solved it with aggressive ESP - which
obviously Porsche would not do because that would kill some of the joy of driving.

Note: Both X4 and Evoque could handle the speed.
Note: Simpliest solution would be to put on narrow tires, which can`t create those sideforces
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      10-10-2014, 03:08 AM   #8
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Well Porsche were hardly going to reply with:
'Thank you for pointing out a major floor with the way our car handles in this situation'
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      10-10-2014, 03:55 AM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Petex3 View Post
Well Porsche were hardly going to reply with:
'Thank you for pointing out a major floor with the way our car handles in this situation'
on Macan forum the Russians do a similar test, same result, But guys are still in denial!

http://www.macanforum.com/forum/maca...-elk-test.html
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      10-10-2014, 05:09 AM   #10
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I forgot: Cayenne does not need/ have the function

This is what you have to pay using an old/inferior platform?
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      10-15-2014, 06:46 AM   #11
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Does anyone have the full video with the X4, Evoque and Macan?
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      10-16-2014, 08:30 AM   #12
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For some reason ) they just filmed Macan. The other two just passed the test.

They measure the highest speed you can pass with:
Macan: 69 kph 911 Carrera: 81kph.
X4:74 kph
Evoque: 75 kph

Notes:
-Macan and X4 had STD 18"; Evoque had STD 19". I have 20" )
-X4 did perform "nice and easy"; Evoque applied brakes - not so nice.
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