Thinking about tracking nearly stock @ VIR

[chillindrdude]

Novice/Level 1 DE driver here...

Normally would have my prepped 944, but I'm driving onwards after the DE weekend to see friends in Asheville and lapping the Tail. The interior is alittle too Spartan.

So I'm tracking the M3. VIR full course is pretty high speed. I'm wondering if just doing Motul 600 and stock pads will be adequate. And save myself $580 for a set of Pag RS29s.

I'm going to 275/295 MPSS tho.

Thoughts?

[MasterC17]

Originally Posted by chillindrdude

Novice/Level 1 DE driver here...

Normally would have my prepped 944, but I'm driving onwards after the DE weekend to see friends in Asheville and lapping the Tail. The interior is alittle too Spartan.

So I'm tracking the M3. VIR full course is pretty high speed. I'm wondering if just doing Motul 600 and stock pads will be adequate. And save myself $580 for a set of Pag RS29s.

I'm going to 275/295 MPSS tho.

Thoughts?

Spending money in all the wrong places.

Pads: Yes, you will destroy stock pads.
Tires: Why on earth would you replace MPSS with MPSS? They are NOT a good track tire. Save the money on the tires, buy the pads.

[AMPowerJ]

You will need brakes!!!

Just do that (pads and fluid) and drive the car and then decide what is next.

The MPSS will get slick and greasy once they are hot so be ready for that. I would start your pressures around 29-30 and see how that works out. You don't want your pressures when hot over 38-40 in my experience for most any tire on the track.

[FTS]

VIR is not terribly hard on brakes; there are really two areas in which you use brakes:

1. Turn 1; approaching at ~145-150 mph down to ~45 mph.
2. After cooking brakes into T1, without much cooling you need light to moderate braking for T3, then hard acceleration and hard braking (short distance) into T4
3. After that you don't need much braking until T14 at the end of back straight, you'll be approaching at ~145-155 mph down to about ~45 mph again
4. Then there is just a slight braking into T16b and that is it.

The long straights allow you to cool the brakes except through T1-4. So, as long as you don't prolong your braking distances by gently braking (brake hard and shortest distance possible), I think you'll be alright; however, stay sensitive to pedal feel and don't take risks. I personally do not know how the stock brakes really perform, but at VIR I think it is possible to manage them if you keep your sessions short (4-5 laps, remember this is a 3.25 mi. track) and allow for brakes to cool.

best of luck.

[CanAutM3]

My take:

The F8X is quite track capable right out of the box, so you should be alright.

The weakest point is the stock pads. No street pad is fully track capable. Although, I must say I was quite impressed with the stock pads doing a 3 day event last fall. I found them pretty stout for street pads. If you do proper brake management, you should be fine. But I would recommend proper track pads.

Stock fluid, if fresh (less than 6 month old), is also perfectly fine. I have been tracking my all M3/4 for the past 14 years all on yearly flushed OEM fluid and never had an issue.

The PSS are also limit for track use. If you don't push them too hard, they will be OK. But if you push them harder with higher slip angles, the outer thread blocks have a tendency to melt and chunk away. Just be watchful, especially if you will be counting on them for a road trip after your time at the track.

Enjoy your track day .

[chillindrdude]

Originally Posted by MasterC17

Spending money in all the wrong places.

Pads: Yes, you will destroy stock pads.
Tires: Why on earth would you replace MPSS with MPSS? They are NOT a good track tire. Save the money on the tires, buy the pads.

not that i'm trying to do this on the cheap, but i am limited by budget, while keeping safety at the forefront.

if i can't score pagid rs29s...i may just buy a new set of front OEM pads in case i want to swap them out after the track weekend. I will rebleed with Motul 600 fluid.

i've got 2400 miles currently on the stock MPSS. i like how they perform thus far on the street. and since this car is not my primary track car, from what i've read, the MPSS is probably the best street tire that will handle a track day 2-3times a year.

after reading CanAutM3's thread, i am going to a wider contact patch by going to a 275/295 MPSS conbo, which i hope will improve grip, without resorting to a R-compound track tire.

[MasterC17]

Originally Posted by chillindrdude

not that i'm trying to do this on the cheap, but i am limited by budget, while keeping safety at the forefront.

if i can't score pagid rs29s...i may just buy a new set of front OEM pads in case i want to swap them out after the track weekend. I will rebleed with Motul 600 fluid.

i've got 2400 miles currently on the stock MPSS. i like how they perform thus far on the street. and since this car is not my primary track car, from what i've read, the MPSS is probably the best street tire that will handle a track day 2-3times a year.

after reading CanAutM3's thread, i am going to a wider contact patch by going to a 275/295 MPSS conbo, which i hope will improve grip, without resorting to a R-compound track tire.

Regarding brakes, if you want to do it on the cheap buy ONLY FRONT pads. Stock rears should be fine. Or buy these: http://f80.bimmerpost.com/forums/sho....php?t=1138759

Regarding tires, I would highly recommend purchasing RE-11's in stock sizes as opposed to going to 275/295 MPSS. Just my opinion. You don't need R-Compounds but replacing the MPSS's with virtually the same thing seems like a waste of money to me. You won't notice the 20mm.

[AMPowerJ]

I think the MPSS is really only good on the track in cold/wet conditions. Otherwise I would go as C17 recommended with RE11s or AD08s.

[MasterC17]

Originally Posted by AMPowerJ

I think the MPSS is really only good on the track in cold/wet conditions. Otherwise I would go as C17 recommended with RE11s or AD08s.

For reference the AD08R's are a fantastic (but pricey) tire, I love them. The RE-11's are a very good option as well.

[chillindrdude]

Originally Posted by MasterC17

Regarding brakes, if you want to do it on the cheap buy ONLY FRONT pads. Stock rears should be fine. Or buy these: http://f80.bimmerpost.com/forums/sho....php?t=1138759

Regarding tires, I would highly recommend purchasing RE-11's in stock sizes as opposed to going to 275/295 MPSS. Just my opinion. You don't need R-Compounds but replacing the MPSS's with virtually the same thing seems like a waste of money to me. You won't notice the 20mm.

thanks,

i am going to heed your advice. tho i might get a set of RE11s in 265/285 ( 35/19)

and front pagid rs29s.

[tcpsoft]

Having run both stock pads and carbotechs at VIR, the CTs are certainly better but the stocks are certainly ok as is the stock fluid. As a novice driver, work on the other things besides maximum velocity on the straights and threshold braking and you'll be amazed at how fast your lap times improve. There have been times where I let up on the throttle a bit down a straight because I knew I'd catch up to another car at an inopportune time, yet saw only a very small change in my overall lap time.

One thing I have noticed with the brakes is they will definitely get overheated (or at least *I* overheat them) with MDM mode on because I tend to overdrive with MDM. I never feel the car slipping with MDM, but it is and the brakes are working overtime to keep it straight and every now and then I catch the blinking lights on the dash. I ran MDM my first time out with the new M3 and then again recently the first time ever on the south course to give a little more room for error. However I also did a 270 on a cold day at turn 4 with MDM off, so....

Bottom line, you'll be fine completely stock for now as I did my first three days at VIR 100% stock. Hopefully you have an instructor with you to keep you squared away. Have fun and be safe.

[evanescent03]

I didn't see anyone mention camber plates .. I know that's a track focused part but it may save the MPSS from getting overheated and breakin apart as some have reported. just a thought.

are you in novice because you haven't driven VIR before? I'd think with a prepped 944 you would be experienced enough to have the confidence to push the f80 pretty hard, thus warranting pads and/or camber plates. camber plates are probably easy to sell off if don't use em.

also depends on how interested you are in squeezing everything out of the weekend. if you don't mind managing the brakes, doing a cool lap, or keeping the speed down a little on the straights you don't need as hard core or components & the stock stuff would be okay. If you want to push the f80 and get as much as you can out of it, you'll want everything mentioned

just my take .. I have less experience than most of the guys who posted but wanted to share those thoughts.

[chillindrdude]

i'm in novice, because i'm a novice.

i only have a handful of DE days under my belt. despite the prepped 944, i might "look good" on the track, but no ego to go with that. i'm still working on my lines and heel/toe downshifting. when i attend DE's, i try to be like a sponge and learn by watching others and doing (what my instructor tells me)

did i mention until last november (when i picked up the 944) I didn't know how to drive a manual?

the 944 is a 10-footer paint job/body work. but it got a sorted/well running powerplant. analog everything, something for me to learn and build on. and most importantly, not put too much track wear/tear on my M3.



Thanks again for the suggestions.

[kitesurfer]

If you are a novice and running in the Novice group not pushing the limits, I would say you will be fine to run all stock. However if you can at least pick up a set of front race pads that would be ideal. Stay away from R-comps until you run in advanced group by then you should have a better understanding of the cars limits and your ability. Many good street Tires that perform well on the track as others have mentioned RE11, Hankook RS3, Yokahama ADO8, BFG Rival, Dunlop Star Spec, ect.
What club are you running with? I'll be running with the Corvette Club at the end of June it would be great to see another M3/M4 out there to give those vetttes hell

[nicknaz]

I agree with the others.

Keep it stock for now and go have fun!

I would normally advocate for a re11 or dunlop star spec type tire but having driven through massive rain in GA and LA states last week i appreciate the void area of the PSS. With the dunlops i would have to go slow on the freeway and watch out for standing water even when full tread. Not great for a long road trip

[JNoSol]

Keep the car stock for the first couple track weekends. You get a free set of brakes during the warrant period, so don't worry about the pads. With good brake management, they will last a few track weekends.

I've been told by others that camber isn't as big of a issue for the F8x compared to the E9x M3.

[smh_amg_m4gts]

I'll be running stock at Laguna Seca tomorrow, so I'll keep you posted.

[smh_amg_m4gts]

If you want to run hard during all of your sessions, get better pads. Tires seem to last through the beating, but definitely will need new tires for the street.

I'd also advise to get PSS Cup2 instead of the PSS. Cup2 last much longer.