[2e9x's]

I have been corresponding with Jeff@eurobahn regarding how the SSTT interacts with both DME v81 and PROGMAN 29.2 and post this update with his permission. Apparently Eurobahn has tested a 135i with v81 and not thrown either a code or lock down. I am also told that they tested a v80, 29.2 335i with SSTT and got no codes, no power reduction and no issues. According to Jeff even with the SSTT connected to the car the BMW dealer's diagnostic equipment was unable to detect its presence. He told me that dealership parts departments continue to sell the product.

PLEASE NOTE: I am ONLY reporting what I was told. This is NOT intended to be a discussion of this tune vs that tune. It is only for people who might be concerned about the compatibility of this particular product. I am also not advocating that anybody take my word for anything. Jeff is very responsive and happy to answer questions. I strongly urge people to make themselves comfortable with any decisions they make and be fully prepared to pay to play.

Driving on the street, even very hard, is not the same as doing a HPDE. I wonder if any issues will arise after a full day on a road course?

[tryangles]

Thanks for the report, I am sure we would all love for Jeff to chime in on this as well as I am very hesitant on letting the service dept do any software updates at this point.

[Mattscott]

the title is not very reassuring either MAY be okay

[continentalg5]

Originally Posted by Mattscott

the title is not very reassuring either MAY be okay

+1

[5soko]

Great info!!! i have had my friend SSTT installed on his new 335i v81 DME for a week now. he loves it, works great.

i contacted split second two days ago aswell, they used the latest software and v81 on there 135i for one month and testing, brought it to there dealership bmw for testing throughout the month along with a 335i and recorded no codes or faults!!

[T Bone]

BTW, when BMW is referring to tuners plugging into the TMAP sensor the photos they use interally are pics of the AA Xcede.

After doing a bunch of reading, I think the SSTT is a good safe option but I would lay low. BMW is just starting to introduce the counter-measures.

[stressdoc]

Not to rain on this parade, but the dealership is not where the mods are going to be detected.

[Mattscott]

Originally Posted by stressdoc

Not to rain on this parade, but the dealership is not where the mods are going to be detected.

FASTA

[2e9x's]

Originally Posted by stressdoc

Not to rain on this parade, but the dealership is not where the mods are going to be detected.

Hence the title of my post...

From what I have been able to learn over the past weeks, if DME v81 detects a piggyback it will literally lock the car down at the dealership. That was confirmed to me by a variety of sources. Terry, Jeff and Shiv (I think) have all concluded that the tuning violation code is NOT hidden from the dealership. So the fact that the cars had no codes is an encouraging sign. Time will tell.

IIRC with a v80 DME but PROGMAN 29.2 torque gets limited to 400nm. Jeff has posted here, and others have opined, that SSTT does not violate those parameters. Perhaps Jeff's tests over the past few days confirms that. Perhaps not. But Jeff's test is encouraging and I would ask him to chime in please.

PERHAPS one thought to take away from this is that the SSTT is a good option because it just does not go too far or try to do too much. It works with the car instead of against it.

I will say this though...over the past week or so I have learned more about tuning than I have over the past year. This forum is fortunate to have some really smart people around and I thank you all for the very interesting discussions.

[2e9x's]

Originally Posted by Mattscott

the title is not very reassuring either MAY be okay

If it makes you feel any better, I'm a lawyer...I always hedge. Occupational hazard you know.

[T Bone]

Originally Posted by 2e9x's

Hence the title of my post...

From what I have been able to learn over the past weeks, if DME v81 detects a piggyback it will literally lock the car down at the dealership. That was confirmed to me by a variety of sources. Terry, Jeff and Shiv (I think) have all concluded that the tuning violation code is NOT hidden from the dealership. So the fact that the cars had no codes is an encouraging sign. Time will tell.

IIRC with a v80 DME but PROGMAN 29.2 torque gets limited to 400nm. Jeff has posted here, and others have opined, that SSTT does not violate those parameters. Perhaps Jeff's tests over the past few days confirms that. Perhaps not. But Jeff's test is encouraging and I would ask him to chime in please.

PERHAPS one thought to take away from this is that the SSTT is a good option because it just does not go too far or try to do too much. It works with the car instead of against it.

I will say this though...over the past week or so I have learned more about tuning than I have over the past year. This forum is fortunate to have some really smart people around and I thank you all for the very interesting discussions.

If someone put a gun to my head and forced me to take a tune, it would be the SSTT.

I think I will just drive my other car for awhile until all this stuff gets sorted out. I am happy with my reliable 335xi stock.

[Jeff@Eurobahn.us]

It was an exhausting week but a very educational one. We were fortunate that our friends had just completed the new training on the new software and counter measures known as FASTA.

The data recording trends and what they are looking for was also most enlightening. They are indeed most concerned about high boosting systems and so have directed their efforts in that area. The SSTT stays well within margins that throw no red flags. We were able to see on their new screen the faults they were looking for. These "adapations" and there are four specific ones that are being examined and recorded will absolutely catch out of margin information.

I was extremely pleased to see that even on our main test vehicle that has hundreds of dyno runs with the SSTT we only threw codes related to wheel speed due to dyno work. Our 135 which has been getting the snot kicked out of it with the SSTT and the intake kit we sell had zero adaptation violations!

All in all we could not be happier with the outcome. Now on to the California Air Resources Board for testing. Once we have our emissions number, anyone who purchased a SSTT in the past year may request a sticker and we will happily give one to you for your vehicle

Jeff
Eurobahn

[ChaneRZ]

hell ya! carb approved! can't wait!

[2e9x's]

Thanks Jeff for chiming in! As always you are a gentleman and bring good stuff to the forum.

Thanks.

[markymarc1979]

Originally Posted by T Bone

BTW, when BMW is referring to tuners plugging into the TMAP sensor the photos they use interally are pics of the AA Xcede.

After doing a bunch of reading, I think the SSTT is a good safe option but I would lay low. BMW is just starting to introduce the counter-measures.

Tbone, when are you going to MOD your 335? You've been debating forever.

[e90AW335i]

Originally Posted by 2e9x's

I am also told that they tested a v80, 29.2 335i with SSTT and got no codes, no power reduction and no issues.

All piggybacks are fine with 29.2. More Power!

[Alias]

Originally Posted by stressdoc

Not to rain on this parade, but the dealership is not where the mods are going to be detected.

+1

IIRC that "Warrenty gone" code can only be detected by bmw

[2e9x's]

Originally Posted by Alias

+1

IIRC that "Warrenty gone" code can only be detected by bmw

Is that true? I agree that at first that was the thought but I was under the impression that folks determined after a while that the dealer could see the code. Over at n54tech there is a screen shot of the dealer's computer with the tuning code on the screen. And just a few posts up Jeff commented that the dealer can see the "Warrenty gone" [sic] code. Did I read all this wrong???

[5soko]

from what i have been reading and emailing tuners, they all seem to have the same answer, these secrets codes are and can be see on a dealership level, nothing really hidden, Terry was able to throw a specific code that was suppose to be hidden and as 2e9x's has mentioned was able to pull the code on the dealership level computer.
Terry, Shiv and Jeff have all confirmed this.

[T Bone]

Originally Posted by Jeff@Eurobahn.us

It was an exhausting week but a very educational one. We were fortunate that our friends had just completed the new training on the new software and counter measures known as FASTA.

The data recording trends and what they are looking for was also most enlightening. They are indeed most concerned about high boosting systems and so have directed their efforts in that area. The SSTT stays well within margins that throw no red flags. We were able to see on their new screen the faults they were looking for. These "adapations" and there are four specific ones that are being examined and recorded will absolutely catch out of margin information.

I was extremely pleased to see that even on our main test vehicle that has hundreds of dyno runs with the SSTT we only threw codes related to wheel speed due to dyno work. Our 135 which has been getting the snot kicked out of it with the SSTT and the intake kit we sell had zero adaptation violations!

All in all we could not be happier with the outcome. Now on to the California Air Resources Board for testing. Once we have our emissions number, anyone who purchased a SSTT in the past year may request a sticker and we will happily give one to you for your vehicle

Jeff
Eurobahn

Nice post Jeff..... I think your SSTT is the best of tuning products (so far) given the cost and how it works.

Please ensure you retain the vigiliance, if the countermeasures are just starting, BMW can adjust.

Keep your head down for this storm.

[T Bone]

Originally Posted by markymarc1979

Tbone, when are you going to MOD your 335? You've been debating forever.

I have the luxury of having a modded M6 in the garage. I may be getting rid of the 335xi. Undecided.

[5soko]

Originally Posted by T Bone

I have the luxury of having a modded M6 in the garage. I may be getting rid of the 335xi. Undecided.

M6 FWIW!!!!!!!!! how can you drive a 335 with a M6 in the garage, you my friend have a great lineup