[Ajs_435d]

Bit of a surprise in the post today, got caught in a temporary speed restriction area doing 69mph in a 60 zone.

I got put on a speed awareness course nearly 2 year ago got caught doing 58 in a 50 zone fixed speed so the speed awareness option has gone. I have a clean license.

How does the penalty amount work? I'm self employed limited company contractor in IT/Software so my contracts vary and haven't earned for a good month or so, my accountant sorts all the bills out.

Anyone else self employed and paid a speeding fine?

[Watsey]

I think you'll find that you'll be asked to declare your annual income. Basing your thoughts on not earned for a month is probably not the most realistic place to start.

If you are asked to declare your income I'd make sure you provide an accurate answer to a clear question. If the question relates to "salary" you may want to respond to that specific point; if it's a question regarding "income" or "earnings" I'd make sure you make a full declaration. I don't think the courts would respond well to a false or partial declaration.

If I get a appending fine I'll be in the same position as you are now.

[MrChumley]

For 69 in a 60 with a clean licence you should be offered a fixed penalty of £100 plus 3 points.

Income only comes into it if it goes to court.

[Ajs_435d]

Thanks chaps, I've no idea with the new system. Had a look on Google, looks to be a massive money earner for them now though lol.

[robbiep]

If you are required to fill in an earnings form, make sure you fill it in honestly, and don't try to 'dodge' around the truth.
Unless, of course, you want a speeding fine to be the least of your worries.

[JD6]

Originally Posted by Ajs_435d

Bit of a surprise in the post today, got caught in a temporary speed restriction area doing 69mph in a 60 zone.

I got put on a speed awareness course nearly 2 year ago got caught doing 58 in a 50 zone fixed speed so the speed awareness option has gone. I have a clean license.

The minimum speed for getting points is 57 in a 50 and 68 in a 60 I believe, i.e. 10% + 2 over.

Sounds like you need to slow down by 2mph!

[robbiep]

Originally Posted by JD6

The minimum speed for getting points is 57 in a 50 and 68 in a 60 I believe, i.e. 10% + 2 over.

Sounds like you need to slow down by 2mph!

Technically they do not have to give any leeway.
If you're doing 31 in a 30, you're fair game.

[Ajs_435d]

Originally Posted by JD6

The minimum speed for getting points is 57 in a 50 and 68 in a 60 I believe, i.e. 10% + 2 over.

Sounds like you need to slow down by 2mph!

Aint that the truth, both have caught me by surprise (both other ends of the country that i have never been before), not that that's an excuse I'll stump up need to be more aware!.

[JNW1]

Originally Posted by MrChumley

For 69 in a 60 with a clean licence you should be offered a fixed penalty of £100 plus 3 points.

Income only comes into it if it goes to court.

+1

A lot of misinformation around regarding income related fines for speeding; they only apply if you're too far over the limit to qualify for a fixed penalty and you're nowhere near that at 69 in a 60. I suppose means testing could come into play if the 69 in a 60 meant you ended-up in court due to the totting-up procedure but with a clean licence I agree the OP is looking at £100 and 3 points.

I have heard of people managing to do more than one SAC within a 3-year period but I think the administration has tightened-up in recent years and hence you're less likely to be able to buck the system and get away with that now!

[Ronstein]

Details here

https://www.gov.uk/speeding-penalties

The majority of people speeding will be classed as committing a 'minor offence' and will still receive a Fixed Penalty Notice (FPN) of a £100 fine and three points on their licence.

You can usually avoid the points and opt for a speed awareness course instead, if it is either: your first speeding offence, or, if you haven't attended an awareness course within the last three years.

In some instances, however, the punishment can be more severe and you may be prosecuted in court leading to a significantly higher fine, more points on your licence or even a driving suspension or disqualification.

Whether or not you're prosecuted is down to the police officer's discretion. The police will usually only opt to prosecute if you are considered a 'serious offender' and have either severely exceeded the speed limit or have repeatedly committed the offence.

However, the fact remains that it is illegal to drive at 31mph in a 30mph zone. So, while it's unlikely you would ever get penalised for this - and even if you did you would most likely be offered a FPN - it is still technically possible to be prosecuted for this offence and sent to court, where you could face the new, higher, revised fines, outlined below.

You will also find yourself in court to be sentenced if you are issued a FPN and ignore it, or if you choose to dispute the charge.

If you are then found guilty in court, as of April 24 2017, your sentence will follow the % of income guidelines.

[JNW1]

Originally Posted by robbiep

Technically they do not have to give any leeway.
If you're doing 31 in a 30, you're fair game.

Technically you're right but on another thread going back a year or so I'm sure another contributor - who was also involved in traffic policing - suggested that a NIP issued for a transgression falling within the old ACPO guidelines wouldn't be pursued if challenged unless there were other aggravating factors to justify a prosecution.

So basically if you're doing no more than the limit plus 10% plus 1mph you should be ok; if you do get a NIP for doing less than that (so say 65 in a 60) it seems that if you challenge it the authorities are unlikely to want to take it to court and it will be quietly dropped.....

[JNW1]

Originally Posted by Ronstein

Whether or not you're prosecuted is down to the police officer's discretion.

I suspect most NIP's are issued with no involvement whatsoever from a traffic police officer; surely the vast majority are now a result of being caught by cameras and they have no discretion whatsoever!

[Ronstein]

Originally Posted by JNW1

I suspect most NIP's are issued with no involvement whatsoever from a traffic police officer; surely the vast majority are now a result of being caught by cameras and they have no discretion whatsoever!

I'm sure you're right about the majority being remote cameras but the decision to prosecute is still made by the police based on the evidence from the camera together with other factors such as weather, location and whether they need extra money!!

[Hooded]

As already said, as long as you don't end up in court you should get a fixed penalty and 3 points below 86mph in a 60 (that's if you don't get offered a speed awareness)

The new fines only apply if you end up in court, which you shouldn't for 69 in a 60

[Ajs_435d]

Cheers chaps, ill find out in due time.

[Gixerste]

Originally Posted by Ajs_435d

Bit of a surprise in the post today, got caught in a temporary speed restriction area doing 69mph in a 60 zone.

I got put on a speed awareness course nearly 2 year ago got caught doing 58 in a 50 zone fixed speed so the speed awareness option has gone. I have a clean license.

How does the penalty amount work? I'm self employed limited company contractor in IT/Software so my contracts vary and haven't earned for a good month or so, my accountant sorts all the bills out.

Anyone else self employed and paid a speeding fine?

Not self employed but just been done for 57 in a 50 after doing the speed awareness course 18 month ago and was offered 3pts and a £100 fine or go to court and risk a £1000 fine and 6pts, so took the 3 pts and £100 fine. PS I did have a clean license

[Ronstein]

The most interesting bit for me was from the link I put at the top

"If you weren’t stopped by the police for the speeding offence (eg it was caught by speed camera), the vehicle’s registered keeper must be sent a notice of intended prosecution within 14 days. You may have to go to court if you ignore the notice"

I wonder how often the notice arrives more than 14 days later!!!

[ahmedb]

Originally Posted by Ronstein

The most interesting bit for me was from the link I put at the top

"If you weren’t stopped by the police for the speeding offence (eg it was caught by speed camera), the vehicle’s registered keeper must be sent a notice of intended prosecution within 14 days. You may have to go to court if you ignore the notice"

I wonder how often the notice arrives more than 14 days later!!!

I recently thought I might have been caught by a camera but the 14 day rule was a bliss, it meant I could stop the sweat 2 weeks post the event. I am, obviously, far more careful now though as I hate that dreaded waiting feel.

[JNW1]

Originally Posted by Ronstein

I'm sure you're right about the majority being remote cameras but the decision to prosecute is still made by the police based on the evidence from the camera together with other factors such as weather, location and whether they need extra money!!

The decision to prosecute may be taken by the police but I very much doubt they're involved when it comes to sending out the Notices of Intention to Prosecute (they simply wouldn't have the resources to vet them all before they're sent). However, on receipt of a NIP I suspect most drivers just accept their fate and simply opt for the SAC or points; only if the NIP's challenged will the police have to decide whether or not to actually prosecute but in most cases it will never come to that (because most of the time the NIP won't be challenged).

In practice, therefore, most people are punished without any real police involvement. I realise that technically accepting a SAC is an alternative to prosecution rather than an actual prosecution but I daresay most drivers in that situation will still feel like they've been done for speeding!

[RichardM]

You may get offered the speed awareness course. They don't seem good at checking if you have been on it before.

[MrChumley]

Slightly OT, but when Mrs C got caught a couple of months ago she got a letter with the NIP, which had a website link where we could see the photos taken by the camera, a map and photos showing the relevant speed limit signs, camera calibration certificate etc etc - presumably to cut down on the number of spurious challenges.

Is that the norm these days?

[XWV]

Originally Posted by MrChumley

Slightly OT, but when Mrs C got caught a couple of months ago she got a letter with the NIP, which had a website link where we could see the photos taken by the camera, a map and photos showing the relevant speed limit signs, camera calibration certificate etc etc - presumably to cut down on the number of spurious challenges.

Is that the norm these days?

I assume it depends on police force. I have one in progress from North Yorkshire at the moment and the NIP stated that there was no obligation for any evidence to be provided at that stage (I think correctly), and none was offered.