[Anthony199]

Hello everyone,

I'm having a frustrating issue with the new brakes on the 650i 2008. To start, the car is abroad so that constraints couple things.

So our brakes were squeaking, and the pads we're almost worn out. I bought the Akebono EUR919 from the rear and EUR918 for the front (these are the correct fitments for the car) from FCP Euro. I have not replaced the discs which honestly are not in great shape. When the mechanics changed the pads, they told me that the discs will last for couple more months, and we barely drive the car so we decided to keep them (bad decision).
Now, the car stops on Akebono pads and bad discs. The braking power is pretty bad, the pedal feels spongy and the car takes way more time and distance to stop than the previous setup.

The mechanic is saying that the pads are too firm, and are not being bedded properly on the discs. Especially on the rear where the pads are barely touching the discs since there is a weird angle. He is saying I should replaced the pads again with softer pads and get new discs. Of course because he wants the safest solution in terms of responsibility.

I am saying that we should replaced the discs (Zimmerman) since the pads are still fairly new (less than 1000 miles on them) and see if the problem gets fixed after 100 or 200 miles. If not, we can replaced the pads again with softer ones (Akebono are ceramic if I'm not wrong). The mechanic doesn't like this idea because if this won't fix the problem, I would have damaged the new discs and I would need to replace them again.

In conclusion, I am thinking about keeping the Akebono pads, changing the discs, see what happens, if the problem is not fixed, change the pads and slightly resurface the new discs. I think new discs would not be as worn and would better grab the new firm pads, causing them to properly bed, as opposed to the old current discs that are shiny and worn out.

What are your thoughts on his and my propositions?
Thanks.

[Welcome to NBA Jam]

What you're describing is normal behavior after changing pads. They will not stop as well as your previous pads for at least 500 miles of city driving. They need to break in and mate to the disc. Eventually your stopping power will be restored.

[Anthony199]

Originally Posted by Welcome to NBA Jam

What you're describing is normal behavior after changing pads. They will not stop as well as your previous pads for at least 500 miles of city driving. They need to break in and mate to the disc. Eventually your stopping power will be restored.

But it has been about 1000 miles of city, traffic and mountain driving, and still not improvement. I have also done a faster bedding procedure where I push the brakes hard from 60mph to 10mph for 10 times and driving afterwards fkr the brakes to cool down before stopping again. Another thing to consider is that the disks need to be replaced anyways, so I don't really want the pads to mate to the current discs. I guess the real question is can I change only discs and expect better braking, or should I change both discs and pads (again)?

[e90yyc]

Originally Posted by Anthony199

But it has been about 1000 miles of city, traffic and mountain driving, and still not improvement. I have also done a faster bedding procedure where I push the brakes hard from 60mph to 10mph for 10 times and driving afterwards fkr the brakes to cool down before stopping again. Another thing to consider is that the disks need to be replaced anyways, so I don't really want the pads to mate to the current discs. I guess the real question is can I change only discs and expect better braking, or should I change both discs and pads (again)?

Change your rotors ASAP and you should be fine. Don't keep trying to mate your pads to them (you already know). Next time, change the rotors at the same time if they're shot.

[gjm120]

I went from oe to Akebono pads. As many others have noticed the initial bite is somewhat less with the Akebonos (as with many ceramic pads). I think overall stopping power is pretty much the same. No change in pedal travel or added sponginess.

When the Akebonos were installed new front rotors went on but rears were the same oe.

[Anthony199]

Originally Posted by e90yyc

Change your rotors ASAP and you should be fine. Don't keep trying to mate your pads to them (you already know). Next time, change the rotors at the same time if they're shot.

Next time I will definitely change rotors too. Man mechanics always give the cheapest option in that country. It's one of those countries that only visit the mechanic when the light pops up on the dash.. haha

I wasn't personally there so I didn't know the condition of the rotors. Anyways, do you think if I change the discs right now and the pads dont mate on the discs, I still have a chance to replace the pads and have proper bedding on the slightly used discs?

[Anthony199]

Originally Posted by gjm120

I went from oe to Akebono pads. As many others have noticed the initial bite is somewhat less with the Akebonos (as with many ceramic pads). I think overall stopping power is pretty much the same. No change in pedal travel or added sponginess.

When the Akebonos were installed new front rotors went on but rears were the same oe.

The sponginess has been going on for a while now, way more than what anyone expected. Especially on mountain roads and excessive use of brakes. The discs are shot, so I will definitely replaced these. I'm just not sure if I should replace the pads as well. Are the discs that you kept in the rear in good shape? My biggest problem seems to be coming from the rear. When I look the gap between the pads and the discs, I can probably fit my pinky between the disc and the pad from the rear side, however the front seems to be in good contact with the disc.

[gjm120]

Originally Posted by Anthony199

The sponginess has been going on for a while now, way more than what anyone expected. Especially on mountain roads and excessive use of brakes. The discs are shot, so I will definitely replaced these. I'm just not sure if I should replace the pads as well. Are the discs that you kept in the rear in good shape? My biggest problem seems to be coming from the rear. When I look the gap between the pads and the discs, I can probably fit my pinky between the disc and the pad from the rear side, however the front seems to be in good contact with the disc.

yes - the rear discs were good. I took a look at my rear caliper and, at least the side I can see w/out removing the wheel, there is no gap between pad and rotor.

[CTinline-six]

I hated the Akebonos when I had them on my car. They had the mysterious clunk noise many here report and the initial bite was not good at all. I was disappointed as I have had great luck with them on my family's vehicles. They also had almost no dust, but the other problems with them made me go back to OEM. I also put on new Zimmerman rotors when I replaced the pads initially.

[Anthony199]

Originally Posted by CTinline-six

I hated the Akebonos when I had them on my car. They had the mysterious clunk noise many here report and the initial bite was not good at all. I was disappointed as I have had great luck with them on my family's vehicles. They also had almost no dust, but the other problems with them made me go back to OEM. I also put on new Zimmerman rotors when I replaced the pads initially.

So you replaced your rotors with Zimmermans, and installed Akebono pads, and hated them? That makes me want to install new pads and rotors instead of just rotors (Zimmerman too) on my lightly used Akebono pads...

[Anthony199]

Originally Posted by gjm120

yes - the rear discs were good. I took a look at my rear caliper and, at least the side I can see w/out removing the wheel, there is no gap between pad and rotor.

Thanks for looking. That gap of mine is probably what's causing the spongy pedal and crap braking. I'm still not sure if I should just put new discs and hope the new disc would better mate with the current pad or if I should replace everything.

[gjm120]

Originally Posted by CTinline-six

I hated the Akebonos when I had them on my car. They had the mysterious clunk noise many here report and the initial bite was not good at all. I was disappointed as I have had great luck with them on my family's vehicles. They also had almost no dust, but the other problems with them made me go back to OEM. I also put on new Zimmerman rotors when I replaced the pads initially.

Is that clunk more of a loud click? I've got a noise when I go from fwd to reverse and vice versa (like when backing into a parking spot).

[gjm120]

Originally Posted by Anthony199

Thanks for looking. That gap of mine is probably what's causing the spongy pedal and crap braking. I'm still not sure if I should just put new discs and hope the new disc would better mate with the current pad or if I should replace everything.

I wonder if something else is amiss. That's quite a gap.

[Anthony199]

Originally Posted by gjm120

I wonder if something else is amiss. That's quite a gap.

I wonder the same too... I kinda trust the mechanic too, so I really doubt it's an installation mistake.

[Anthony199]

Originally Posted by gjm120

Is that clunk more of a loud click? I've got a noise when I go from fwd to reverse and vice versa (like when backing into a parking spot).

I'm thinking that's a differential problem. Not sure tho. There was a thread about 2 weeks ago about a clicking noise coming from the back, and can be most seen when going up tight corners in a parking lot for example. Does it sound familiar?

[gjm120]

Originally Posted by Anthony199

I'm thinking that's a differential problem. Not sure tho. There was a thread about 2 weeks ago about a clicking noise coming from the back, and can be most seen when going up tight corners in a parking lot for example. Does it sound familiar?

I should have been more clear - noise is definitely from the front. I put on adjustable endlinks and was wondering if that could be the source.

[gjm120]

Originally Posted by Anthony199

I wonder the same too... I kinda trust the mechanic too, so I really doubt it's an installation mistake.

Is that gap on both sides of the rotor and on both wheels?

[Anthony199]

Originally Posted by gjm120

Is that gap on both sides of the rotor and on both wheels?

Yes, gap on rear both pass and driver side. The gap however is only on one side of the pad. So from the front of the pad (or the rear, forgot) the pad is touching with the disk. The other side is not. Imagine the pad sitting 30° degrees off of the disc, instead of 0° degrees where they would be parallel. I might have noticed that the discs are actually not straight either, so the problem might be largely from the discs... I don't want to pay labor twice to try out new discs, then lay labor again to change pads

[gjm120]

Originally Posted by Anthony199

Yes, gap on rear both pass and driver side. The gap however is only on one side of the pad. So from the front of the pad (or the rear, forgot) the pad is touching with the disk. The other side is not. Imagine the pad sitting 30° degrees off of the disc, instead of 0° degrees where they would be parallel. I might have noticed that the discs are actually not straight either, so the problem might be largely from the discs... I don't want to pay labor twice to try out new discs, then lay labor again to change pads

If you had warped rotors the gap would move with wheel rotation... I think. Also, that is a huge warping and rotors usually don't often warp, but, they pick up pad deposits (same effect as warping but not exactly the same thing).

I think you need to pull the rotors and also maybe the calipers off and see what's going on. This isn't a big deal as no brake lines need to be disconnected. So if you diy shouldn't be too hard or too expensive for a shop. Maybe the mechanic that did your brake job will take a look as he might have installed something wrong.

I don't think you will ruin anything by putting on new rotors with the Akebono pads and see what happens. If I recall Akebono don't suggest a bedding in procedure but that may just be a liability thing (finding a road where you can do multiple 60mph to 10mph hard braking is difficult)

Lot of people on here combine Akebono with Zimmerman with good results. (The clunk is more of an annoyance.) There is low bite which drives some people to go back to OEM. FWIW I've installed Akebono's with new Stoptech slotted fronts and the original rear discs. Stopping is very good but bite is noticeably less than oe pads.

[Anthony199]

Originally Posted by gjm120

If you had warped rotors the gap would move with wheel rotation... I think. Also, that is a huge warping and rotors usually don't often warp, but, they pick up pad deposits (same effect as warping but not exactly the same thing).

I think you need to pull the rotors and also maybe the calipers off and see what's going on. This isn't a big deal as no brake lines need to be disconnected. So if you diy shouldn't be too hard or too expensive for a shop. Maybe the mechanic that did your brake job will take a look as he might have installed something wrong.

I don't think you will ruin anything by putting on new rotors with the Akebono pads and see what happens. If I recall Akebono don't suggest a bedding in procedure but that may just be a liability thing (finding a road where you can do multiple 60mph to 10mph hard braking is difficult)

Lot of people on here combine Akebono with Zimmerman with good results. (The clunk is more of an annoyance.) There is low bite which drives some people to go back to OEM. FWIW I've installed Akebono's with new Stoptech slotted fronts and the original rear discs. Stopping is very good but bite is noticeably less than oe pads.

I am not super worried about the bite. It's more the stopping distance and the spongy pedal. Like, I push the pedal to the max, and I don't get my face smashed to the windshield as before. It dangerously slow braking in my opinion. Anyways... Labor is not really that expensive, probably around 50$ for the job. I'm basically just saving the time in going back twice to the mechanic and keeping the car with him for two days instead of half a day.

I might just go with the Zimmerman rotors, and see what happens. If I don't see results improving over every drive, I'll change the pads again.

[Pauloxxi]

My akebono created a condition of stick slip when I brake. It is not warped rotor. I can fix the stick slip by breaking firm and hard, so it kind of "cleans" some sort of deposit in my rotor and stick slip fixes... I love not seeing all that dust in my wheels, but this stick slip kind of frustrates me. I'll go back to OEM.

[Anthony199]

Originally Posted by pauloxxi

My akebono created a condition of stick slip when I brake. It is not warped rotor. I can fix the stick slip by breaking firm and hard, so it kind of "cleans" some sort of deposit in my rotor and stick slip fixes... I love not seeing all that dust in my wheels, but this stick slip kind of frustrates me. I'll go back to OEM.

Based on the mixed reviews, I decided to ditch the Akebonos and get new softer pads and new discs. Thanks for your input and everyone else's, these forums are priceless and so valuable.