[UdubBadger]

So I've had my car for about 9 1/2 months now, its been a blast to own (best out of any I've ever had) and fun to mod, however I recently have been thinking of going to an 04-05 330i zhp. I lease my car for $430 a month, put $2k down plus the security deposit and went with 36 mo. with 12k miles/ yr. I guess with the economy dwindling right now, my initial thought of doing this was because instead of leasing and possibly financing at the end, why aren't I just financing right now around the same $ per month? I am a student right now, have a few years left as I'm not going full time (about 3 yrs) and I only work PT but get decent pay for the hours I do work. I am fine with affording the payments right now, that isn't the problem... it just seems like a waste right now to be leasing on a car that might be worth a lot less at the end of the lease than was anticipated. Also, I've found out that 12k miles/yr is a bit low for my use as I currently sit at 12563 miles. I can always buy more, but whats the point if I was considering buying out at the end of the lease?

I guess here are my pros and cons up for discussion/debate...

-E90 is new (or was) so maintenance is covered and condition is excellent while E46 will have more miles (and physical wear) and possibly no warranty unless its CPO.

-E90 is xDrive which is great to have in winter up here in WI, however, I might be transferring back to Chicago next year and would be doing a lot of city driving where streets are plowed and a good set of winters would be all I need so the AWD might not be as necessary then).

- While both cars would be about the same monthly price... I'd be paying to own the E46 which isn't the case right now on the E90, however, I've already sunk $ into the E90 from the down payment and paying sales tax on it.

-While I do love my E90, it was basic, no pkgs and the only option is htd seats. I've done a lot of mods to make it more of my own, but its those little things like zsp seats and steering wheel and zpp features (also the split folding seats in the zcp) that I still yearn for. On the other hand, $3-4k in mods is hard to part with seeing as I might only get 1/2 of that back selling them off and then would be driving a pretty basic E46 for the most part... at least for a while.

So I guess the real question is should I even look into doing this (getting out of my lease and trying to find the right 330i zsp? Or should I just stay in the lease for now and possibly look later on if my situation changes? Or do I just dismiss the thought completely and stick to the plan of leasing for another 26 months and then planning on buying at the end?

Also if I do decide to look into a switch more... what should I be looking for in terms of the lease swap... 1/2 my down payment... more? I've commented on a lot of FS listings on here but never had to put one of my own together.

Thanks for the advice.

[addy85]

So whats the real problem? Maybe I didn't read carefully enough but it seems to me that you just don't like the car because of the lack of options?

[UdubBadger]

not really... I don't think that enough to call it THE reason, however it would be a benift of going to a zsp.

I think it has more to do with the combination of the economy and what used cars are worth now (could be getting a better deal than normal as its kinda becoming a buyers market) and also the fact that I'm not currently paying $430/mo to own a depreciating asset, but "renting" it and if the direction of the economy doesn't improve enough, I could be looking to pay more to buy the E90 at the end of the lease than what its worth. Also the fact that I'm putting more miles on the car than the lease will allow so if I own its a little bit more flexible in that aspect.

[addy85]

We'll I never recommend anyone to buy a lease at the end but to each his own. If I were you i'd probably look for an 07 E90 rather then an E46. That way you could still have the maintenance plan and could probably find a certified one at a dealership.

[UdubBadger]

Well the problem with that is it probably wouldn't be in my budget to get an 07 or even an 06. In terms of leasing I'm at what I can afford right now. In terms of financing, I'd be looking for a similar if not less of a monthly payment as I've found a several 04-05 zhp's with under 45k miles for $20-24k which would put me between at or below $440/month for 60 months at about 6.5% APR which I could easily obtain).

Also, someone on the E46fanatics board mentioned you can have an 04-05 CPO'd at a BMW dealer for price... anyone have any knowledge of that process?

[JSpira]

Originally Posted by UdubBadger

Or do I just dismiss the thought completely and stick to the plan of leasing for another 26 months and then planning on buying at the end?

.

Herein lies the problem. You should have financed from the beginning. It is far more costly to lease if you plan to buy at the end than to finance.

[UdubBadger]

Originally Posted by JSpira

Herein lies the problem. You should have financed from the beginning. It is far more costly to lease if you plan to buy at the end than to finance.

obviously thats what I would have liked to do but if that was the case I wouldn't be in an E90 in the 1st place... i needed an AWD car for work that was good (or better I should say) on gas. With American cars aside (I hate fords and chevys) The leases on Volvos/Subarus and other AWD cars I looked at were about the same if not MORE expensive... the resale on the bmws made the lease the least expensive that I found... probably also cuz everyone except the BMW sales guy were pricks and didn't want to give me a square deal cuz they could get more $ outta me.

[ezmaass]

This is simple finance. Add up the costs both ways.

Cost to continue the lease:
- $430/month for X more months = $TOTAL
- Cost of anticipated mileage overage at $0.20/mile
- Maintenance = $0 assuming you stay under 50k miles

Cost to switch and own:
- Cost to get out of your lease. Call BMW Financial Services and run the scenario. I'd be surprised if it wasn't a few thousand easily.
- Cost of loss modifications ($3k+)
- Cost of undoing those modifications to turn the car back in ($?)
- Cost of maintenance on an older e46. I owned an e46 for 6 years before getting my e90. I can tell you that in the later years I easily racked up a few thousand dollars in repairs. Little things like a blower resister motor, an oil separator, new battery, broken window regulators (well known issue on e46), door seals, etc. BMW service ranges from around $90 - $130/hr depending upon your area of the country. Parts aren't cheap either. I'd expect to pay at least $1,000 in service/repairs each year you own an out of warranty e46 with mileage under 100k.
- Residual value. When I traded in my decently loaded e46 for the 335i, I think I got $10k for it. It had just about 120,000 miles on it, and it was well loaded with Xenon headlights, navigation system (very rare for an early e46), etc. So calculate what it'll be worth when you're done making a payments on it. In five years it'll be a 9 - 10 year old car....

My advice would be to stick with what you've got. You'll immediately be paying a few thousand out of pocket to exit the lease, plus you'll lose your modification investments (presumably), and the out of warranty costs for a student with a PT job (unless you have a decently large and liquid savings) shouldn't be overlooked. Although my experience was quite good, I know guys who dropped a few thousand in a single visit to the dealer on their e46 for transmission issues or bigger mechanical problems that popped up.

[1cleanm6]

get a 335i....you can afford it extend your payment term.

Or better yet get a nice 04 m3..they can be had cheap now adays..

[madisonsfinest]

I would stick with what you have started. You can afford it, maintenance is covered, and if you had an 04-05 that is not CPO, and I don't think there are many that are, you are going to be paying a ton of money to fix. I would wait, and next time around, depending on the financing at the time, get a 2 year old that you want. Wait, I think you can get 05-06 CPO with like 2.9% financing.... I bought mine with 2.9% financing and no money down. Of course I'm paying to own, and my payment is a bit higher than yours.

[1cleanm6]

oh also ive owned a 05zhp before and the 335icoupe i have no puts the zhp to shame.

Speed comfort and everything wise is totally different, eventhough i loved my zhp..

[ezmaass]

As for the extended warranty from BMW, I'm pretty certain that you need to be the original owner/registrant of the car. I don't believe you can buy a used BMW from Joe Blow and bring it to BMW to get an extended warranty.

[UdubBadger]

Originally Posted by ezmaass

As for the extended warranty from BMW, I'm pretty certain that you need to be the original owner/registrant of the car. I don't believe you can buy a used BMW from Joe Blow and bring it to BMW to get an extended warranty.

thats what I figured so maybe it the guy who mentioned it was the original owner and willing to go do it for whatever it cost before he sold it.

[UdubBadger]

Originally Posted by Boosted335

get a 335i....you can afford it extend your payment term.

Or better yet get a nice 04 m3..they can be had cheap now adays..

how can I afford a 335 if I barely afford leasing a 328xi???

[UdubBadger]

Originally Posted by ezmaass

This is simple finance. Add up the costs both ways.

Cost to continue the lease:
- $430/month for X more months = $TOTAL
- Cost of anticipated mileage overage at $0.20/mile
- Maintenance = $0 assuming you stay under 50k miles

Cost to switch and own:
- Cost to get out of your lease. Call BMW Financial Services and run the scenario. I'd be surprised if it wasn't a few thousand easily.
- Cost of loss modifications ($3k+)
- Cost of undoing those modifications to turn the car back in ($?)
- Cost of maintenance on an older e46. I owned an e46 for 6 years before getting my e90. I can tell you that in the later years I easily racked up a few thousand dollars in repairs. Little things like a blower resister motor, an oil separator, new battery, broken window regulators (well known issue on e46), door seals, etc. BMW service ranges from around $90 - $130/hr depending upon your area of the country. Parts aren't cheap either. I'd expect to pay at least $1,000 in service/repairs each year you own an out of warranty e46 with mileage under 100k.
- Residual value. When I traded in my decently loaded e46 for the 335i, I think I got $10k for it. It had just about 120,000 miles on it, and it was well loaded with Xenon headlights, navigation system (very rare for an early e46), etc. So calculate what it'll be worth when you're done making a payments on it. In five years it'll be a 9 - 10 year old car....

My advice would be to stick with what you've got. You'll immediately be paying a few thousand out of pocket to exit the lease, plus you'll lose your modification investments (presumably), and the out of warranty costs for a student with a PT job (unless you have a decently large and liquid savings) shouldn't be overlooked. Although my experience was quite good, I know guys who dropped a few thousand in a single visit to the dealer on their e46 for transmission issues or bigger mechanical problems that popped up.

ok I like that train of thought, however I've also been a bit more "liberal" with my choice in mods as it pertains to the "permanence" of them such as selling my RFT tires/oem rims and getting springs/muffler delete which will also require $ to be reversed or re-purchased if I do indeed turn in the car at the end of the lease so I guess either way I'll be paying a little to "un-mod" the car

also in terms of the mileage overage, I would probably just buy more before the lease ends at $0.16/mile

[madisonsfinest]

I think you may be able to take the car to a bmw dealer to have it cpo'd but it costs like $1000.00 I'm pretty sure I was told that before. Of course I think it has to be within the years that they make them a CPO..... so you can't bring in a '99 and pay to have it CPO'd if that makes any sense.

[UdubBadger]

right but 04-05's would probably be eligible so thats what I was considering doing.

[UdubBadger]

anyone else with any other opinions?

[nicknaz]

OP, couple of thoughts:

- If cost is such a concern, you screwed yourself by modding a leased car. You flushed that money away and will have to pay more/go through hassle to remove the mods at lease end. You could have purchased the options or the car you really wanted instead of spending on mods

- Each time you switch cars you incur transaction costs to switch the plates, dealer license fees, etc etc etc

- E46 are getting old. You haven't factored any maintenance or repair into your budget. If you need a new clutch, that's $1k. If you need new brakes and rotors, that's $1k. Those are typical upkeep for older cars and $2k is 5 months of trouble free ownership of your leased car. I tried the whole 'buy a reliable used car because its cheaper' by getting a '02 WRX. nothing broke, but the cost of maintenance plus the loan payment is the same as a brand new bmw lease. why bother with the hassle of the older car?

personally, i think you should stick your lease and then use the depreciated value of the car at lease end to negotiate a lower purchasing cost. BMW knows the residual is artificially high, and if you offer a price that is in between the residual and actual (low) market value, they're likely to give you the deal rather than be stuck with the car and eat cost of carrying the inventory on a car that no one will want (base model 328xi is hard to sell)

Also, the way to go with a leased car is just put in gas, change the tires, take it to dealer when free services are required and just drive it. And if possible expense mileage for business

3yr lease is not bad when you are a student.. you can ride out the crap econ and let someone else take the monster depreciation hit and when you start working you can get a 'keeper' that you really want (or maybe you will have a ton of loans.. student with a BMW.. wtf.. better have rich parents or a free ride for tuition or something)

anyway, best of luck

[positiveions]

I have 41 almost 42k on my '05 zhp. THank God, I haven't had any problem. I recently installed Koni KYB with Eibach springs; which lowered the vehicle only 1/4 of inch. Car still drives superb, handles like a mother, and very smooth on the road. No problems with this car so far. I love it! It is when I read on the forum that too many people having too many issues makes me rethink to get into any of E9X models; whether be it 335, or M3.

[BMWI6]

dude for real if you want a good car to buy that will not depreciate much further then look into a low mile 2002-2003 m2 which you can find for around 22-24k..... man i would trade in my 335 for one of those in a heartbeat.

[UdubBadger]

Originally Posted by Nick Nazareno

OP, couple of thoughts:

- If cost is such a concern, you screwed yourself by modding a leased car. You flushed that money away and will have to pay more/go through hassle to remove the mods at lease end. You could have purchased the options or the car you really wanted instead of spending on mods

- Each time you switch cars you incur transaction costs to switch the plates, dealer license fees, etc etc etc

- E46 are getting old. You haven't factored any maintenance or repair into your budget. If you need a new clutch, that's $1k. If you need new brakes and rotors, that's $1k. Those are typical upkeep for older cars and $2k is 5 months of trouble free ownership of your leased car. I tried the whole 'buy a reliable used car because its cheaper' by getting a '02 WRX. nothing broke, but the cost of maintenance plus the loan payment is the same as a brand new bmw lease. why bother with the hassle of the older car?

personally, i think you should stick your lease and then use the depreciated value of the car at lease end to negotiate a lower purchasing cost. BMW knows the residual is artificially high, and if you offer a price that is in between the residual and actual (low) market value, they're likely to give you the deal rather than be stuck with the car and eat cost of carrying the inventory on a car that no one will want (base model 328xi is hard to sell)

Also, the way to go with a leased car is just put in gas, change the tires, take it to dealer when free services are required and just drive it. And if possible expense mileage for business

3yr lease is not bad when you are a student.. you can ride out the crap econ and let someone else take the monster depreciation hit and when you start working you can get a 'keeper' that you really want (or maybe you will have a ton of loans.. student with a BMW.. wtf.. better have rich parents or a free ride for tuition or something)

anyway, best of luck

those are very good points... thanks for the insight.


and as far as the student driving a BMW... I'm not some 19 yr old trust fund baby (if i was I'd probably have a fully modded 335i or M3 and wouldn't be concerned about my finances at all)... I'm actually turning 27 this December and my 20 hr a week PT job as a photographer is actually better paying that a few people I know who work FT retail positions. Instead of rush off to college right away, I waited, saved $ and was smart when i came to Wisconsin, lived here for a year before enrolling PT in school and got in state tuition which is dirt cheap up here. I also try to be smart with my money (though in this situation/thread it doesn't sound like it but...) I don't waste money on going out, drinking, or things like that which enables me to be able to afford things like a nice car, snowboard trips and more rewarding things than puking in a strangers bushes at 2am on a Saturday morning after a $75 bar tab.



back to the thread... I think what you said is really what I needed to hear, I'll just keep on with the lease for now but I don't know if I will be able to shake the thought that right now I could be paying to own instead of rent (which is obviously something i should have taken into account before I signed the lease).