[M-technik-3]

https://www.yahoo.com/news/eu-bans-s...195726418.html

EU now banning new car sales of ICE so I really can't see too many more cool cars coming out of our favorite car companies.

[440i6MT]

Over/under on several EU countries not complying with that unattainable crap?

[Maestro]

Until these idiots figure out they will have mine most of the earth to mind enough rare earth metals to make enough batteries, and watch them ban mining or refuse to mine in countries that treat people people badly.

[Murf the Surf]

Originally Posted by Maestro

Until these idiots figure out they will have mine most of the earth to mind enough rare earth metals to make enough batteries, and watch them ban mining or refuse to mine in countries that treat people people badly.

Mining is such an environmentally clean process too.

[ASAP]

you guys remember when they told everyone in Europe that clean diesels were the way to go lol?

then we found out diesel pollution is actually greater and then we found out VW was actually cheating in just about every emission test...

i sort of see this going the same way

[Alfisti]

I know I could read the article but off hand, what is their definition of EV? I ask as I suspect that here, in North America at least, PHEV's will have to count. Is this the same in this announcement or pure EV?

[Ste42]

Originally Posted by Alfisti

I know I could read the article but off hand, what is their definition of EV? I ask as I suspect that here, in North America at least, PHEV's will have to count. Is this the same in this announcement or pure EV?

It will be ICE only that is banned. Hybrids will have to be still allowed as there is no way the infrastructure will be in place for all electric. The UK's current charging infrastructure is a joke.

[Alfisti]

Are you just saying that or is that what the announcement says? I cannot find anything related to PHEV.

[dreamingat30fps]

Originally Posted by Alfisti

Are you just saying that or is that what the announcement says? I cannot find anything related to PHEV.

It's yahoo, it's shit. However they link to this other article for CA specifically and they say EV and PHEVs from my understanding.

https://ww2.arb.ca.gov/news/californ...%20N%2D79%2D20.

[Alfisti]

THat's not the EU though. It's a vital distinction with global consequences if the EU bans PHEV's..

[diablo2112]

Wishingcasting isn't policy. The year-over-year growth in ZEV/PHEV sales in that graph is just nonsense. This is what happens when zealots make policy ignorant of engineering reality.

[Ste42]

If you don't live in the UK then you don't get it. Hundreds of thousands of homes in the UK don't even have driveways and many just park on the pavement (sidewalk to most of you guys). Where will they charge their electric only cars?

[Alfisti]

Originally Posted by Ste42

If you don't live in the UK then you don't get it. Hundreds of thousands of homes in the UK don't even have driveways and many just park on the pavement (sidewalk to most of you guys). Where will they charge their electric only cars?

It's even worse here, which I why I keep asking, are PHEV's allowed?

[Ste42]

Originally Posted by Alfisti

It's even worse here, which I why I keep asking, are PHEV's allowed?

Not sure as the article is about the EU and we are no longer in the EU so it won't apply here. I can see hybrids and full electrics being the only cars allowed from 2035 in the UK but zero chance of it being all electric from that date.

[Germanauto]

The world is changing too fast, I can't keep up.

[Soul_Glo]

I feel like people are being screwed over. Forcing people to go electric and the infrastructure is not there.

[Alfisti]

Originally Posted by Ste42

Not sure as the article is about the EU and we are no longer in the EU so it won't apply here. I can see hybrids and full electrics being the only cars allowed from 2035 in the UK but zero chance of it being all electric from that date.

It does matter. Manufacturers are not going to build hybrids just for select markets. They will lobby to have one standard. WHich again, is why I am asking if this latest policy includes PHEV's or not. No one seems to know.

[bagekko]

Many companies will still be building ICE cars until beyond 2050, you may not be able to buy them in EU, USA, etc. So much of Africa, South America, Southeast Asia, Russia, Mongolia, Western China etc is so remote with minimal infrastructure where EVs will never work. ICE will probably not 100% die in any of our lifetimes. I always laugh the past few years when EV's are discussed in India, they have frequent power cuts all over how the heck can they handle EV charging. At least in the US at least Wyoming is doing the opposite and wants 0 EV sales by 2035 lol.

I have an EV, I hate the push to battery EVs, ZERO of the EV goals will be met. All $ should be funneled into a better solution than stupid battery EVs.

[br438]

As others have wondered... I wonder if China is going to go all electric? India? Pakistan?


Also... Russia?

This will be interesting to see when the people realize that the king has no clothes.

With that said, I would love to have an affordable, quality EV, that was sourced/built from truly environmentally friendly and humane practices... with truly renewable energy to charge it... for local journeys around town.

[E92 M Sport]

Makes sense. I’m sure their grid can handle it just like ours, especially since they’re importing how much energy? Another racket.

[bagekko]

A cheap alternative to ICE for trips 1-10 miles from home if what everyone could have right now if the current path wasn't so F'ed up. Thats what we use our EV for short quick trips around town.

What's funny is over the last 20 yrs or so, many alternatives have been discussed/pursued; bio-diesel, hydrogen, ethanol, methane, natural gas, various battery options. Yet we are pushing hard of the costly 1000s of tiny battery options, which in the US has made only a minor impact over the last 15yrs that EVs have been sold.

People need to start asking for a cheap greener alternative that isn't a total PITA. Need to stop using the acronym EV as it is not the planet saving future.

Originally Posted by br438

With that said, I would love to have an affordable, quality EV, that was sourced/built from truly environmentally friendly and humane practices... with truly renewable energy to charge it... for local journeys around town.

[dradernh]

Originally Posted by Murf the Surf

Mining is such an environmentally clean process too.

Useful data point: in the Western world, it takes 15-20 years for a new mine to come on-line. Note that more mines in Western countries will be required if the goal of moving all of us to EVs is to be met. This is regardless of the transition end-dates being tossed-about today (e.g., 2030, 2035, 2050, etc.).

Originally Posted by dreamingat30fps

this other article for CA specifically and they say EV and PHEVs from my understanding.

https://ww2.arb.ca.gov/news/californ...%20N%2D79%2D20.

CARB has been living in a dream world since at least the 1980s, when it declared that 10% of new vehicles sold in California would be emissions-free by the year 2000.

That fail was, hilariously, explained-away by the ignorant and the purposefully uninformed as GM taking its EV1 off the market so as to prevent the transition to non-fossil fuel vehicles. Mind you, the EV1 was the only EV available at the time, it was not for sale, quoted lessors of the day appeared to be exclusively virtue-signaling Hollywood types, and total production of the EV1 came in at barely over 1,100 units before GM gave up and threw in the towel.

Even for the time, such a spectacular fail was well into you-cain't-hardly-make-this-chit-upp territory. Of course, one had to be paying attention at the time to get it.

The bottom line is unchanged for something as significant as this transition is: double the time estimates published by qualified sources. Then triple them. Do the same for the costs. At that point, you will be well within a realistic ballpark of what's going to happen. Yes, there are always exceptions, and for something this incredibly huge, those are likely to take place on the downside (i.e., later and more costly than estimated, all along the way). For all of us, let's hope we end up doing at least better than that.