|
|
|
|
Post Reply |
|
Thread Tools | Search this Thread |
07-14-2008, 08:26 PM | #1 |
Lieutenant Colonel
223
Rep 1,565
Posts |
How to reduce understeer: 3 cheap or free mods you can do
I had this question asked via PM, thought it was pertinent enough to post.
Three things that you can do to reduce understeer AND keep the same stock ride you have now. 1. 5mm spacers for the front. Will increase the front track. But will probably want to purchase a stud kit. The Vorshlag 60mm tud kit is what we are using. There's enough length on the studs to run a ~10mm spacer if you have to in the future. 2. Rear sway bar - the bar itself is fairly inexpensive, but labor might be pricey. Install is a major PITA without a lift or proper experience. 90% of you guys should NOT try the install at home. The rear sway is a VERY worthwhile upgrade. It not for the install pain, it would be #1 on the list. 3. Grind down the alignment pin - you should be able to get an additional ~0.5 deg neg camber out of the stock setup. Just remove the front struts, and grind down the alingment pin. It's the small "bump" that you see on the stock top hats. It protudes out of the shock tower as well, the OEM shock towers have an opening for it. The stock shock towers are slotted, but with the alignment pin it doesn't seem to allow you to use the full adjustment that's there. So free mod here, it'll just take some elbow grease. 4. Camber plates - Not that cheap, but will help tons and will have minimal effect on the comfortable stock ride. You will have slightly worse front tire wear but the increased front grip will be fairly substantial. We're running the Vorshlag plates in the front, but go with whoever. Lastly, not cheap, but this will give you the best bang for your buck, KW V3's. We use the V3's on all of our race cars. We used the Japanese stuff for some years, in 2005 we switched over to KW and never looked back. On the E82 in particular, you'd be amazed at how easy it is to drive fast in the car, and how compliant the suspension is on the street. IMO, it's a perfect balance between a sporty yet comfortable ride, and spring rates that are stiff enough to go fast when pushed. I think KW nailed it on the head for a street driven car that sees occasional track duty. If you can, go for a test ride in someone else's KW V3 equipped 1er. Hope that helps! |
07-14-2008, 10:11 PM | #2 |
Private First Class
18
Rep 170
Posts
Drives: 2011 E90 M3
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Columbus, OH
|
"...I think KW nailed it on the head for a street driven car that sees occasional track duty"... I thought I read that the KW V2 would meet this need? Do you really think I would need to step up to the V3 for the use you describe above? A bit of a newbie on suspension but am trying to understand the real need between the V2 and V3. Thanks.
Great post by the way
__________________
DD & Track Car: 2011 E90 M3 w/Ohlin R&T's, Vorshlag camber plates, Hotchkis swaybars and other mods.
(2008 135i modded - SOLD, 2006 E90 330xi - SOLD, 1995 M3 track car - SOLD) |
Appreciate
0
|
07-15-2008, 07:22 AM | #4 |
Major
36
Rep 1,329
Posts |
you forgot one. Larger front tires and wheels.
also with a good set of vise grips you can just twist the alignment pins off. that way you do not need to remove the struts, much much quicker. |
Appreciate
0
|
07-15-2008, 09:36 AM | #5 |
Lieutenant Colonel
223
Rep 1,565
Posts |
TMC - There's such a small difference in price between the V2 & V3. You might as well get the dual adjustability of the V3's. I'm fairly certain that they use the same spring for all of them, V1, V2, & V3's. If you are just a looking for the lowered stance, and a quality coilover, I would say go with the V1. There is some decent coin to be saved there.
BMWeber - new wheel/tire setup is a given, but we're listing off cheaper budget mods. Good tip on the alingment pins! |
Appreciate
0
|
07-15-2008, 09:47 AM | #7 |
Lieutenant General
2146
Rep 10,176
Posts |
Great post! FYI, the alignment pins twist out. So, there's no need to grind them down.
Also, I would recommend a 10mm spacer with hubcentric ring built onto it for the fronts. I use that with my stock 215 fronts and there's plenty of room still. It also gives it a bit more aggressive look. Use the longer lug bolts that come with the 10mm spacers, and you won't need wheel studs. I hate using 5mm spacers because they do not have a hubcentric ring, and you are putting too much weight on the bolts. |
Appreciate
0
|
07-15-2008, 10:31 AM | #8 | |
Major General
2725
Rep 6,750
Posts |
Quote:
If you use a spacer on stock rims, there will be extra torque applied to the hub - and possibly to the bearing (not sure of the actual geometry and if is the case or not). Can we please have the "definitive" word on this? :smile:
__________________
2018 F80 Santorini 2019 Z4 3.0i 2022 X2 M35i |
|
Appreciate
0
|
07-15-2008, 10:43 AM | #9 |
Santa Fe Concorso
103
Rep 2,984
Posts |
I can't remember which forum it came from, but the definitive answer on load was that the 'load bearing surface' was between the hub face (not the hub lip) and the back of the wheel bolt pattern. That does not address the bearing question, although I've never heard of BMW wheel bearing failures being a problem.
__________________
Santa Fe Concorso - The Southwest's Premier Automotive Gathering.
|
Appreciate
0
|
07-15-2008, 10:51 AM | #10 |
Lieutenant General
2146
Rep 10,176
Posts |
adc, yes, you are putting more stress on the hubs. However, BMWs are not prone to issues with bearing. I know that Evos and WRXs are. I've been doing track and autocross events with BMW clubs for a decade, and bearings are not a weak point of these cars, even with cut out fenders and 30mm spacers.
|
Appreciate
0
|
07-15-2008, 11:20 AM | #12 |
Brigadier General
457
Rep 4,822
Posts |
BerkTechnology, why aren't you recommending KW club sport that has a adjustable top mount? It will allow about negative 2 degrees camber if I am not mistaken...
|
Appreciate
0
|
07-15-2008, 05:14 PM | #14 |
Major
77
Rep 1,376
Posts
Drives: 1988 M3, 1990 M3, 1998 M3/4
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Oklahoma City, OK
iTrader: (7)
Garage List 1998 BMW M3/4 [10.00]
2011 BMW M3 Sedan [9.28] 1988 BMW M3 [9.40] 1990 BMW M3 [10.00] 2008 BMW 135i - sold [0.00] 2003 BMW M3 - sold [0.00] |
nice post. I am totally on the fence between KW's and a TCK setup. Very hard to decide. Any insight? Also interested in hearing why no the club sports.
__________________
1988 BMW M3 - Hennarot/Black
1990 BMW M3 racecar - Diamond Schwarz/Black 1998 BMW M3 - Alpine White/Mulberry 2011 BMW 328i racecar - LeMans Blue/Black |
Appreciate
0
|
07-15-2008, 05:41 PM | #15 |
Unindicted co-conspirator
66
Rep 1,734
Posts
Drives: to work, mostly.
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania / Detroit, Michigan
|
Just curious -- why is the rear sway a pain to install? On other vehicles, I've found this to be one of the more painless ones to do (although these were all FWD cars...so I've probably just answered my question....)
|
Appreciate
0
|
07-17-2008, 01:36 PM | #17 | |
Private No Class
11
Rep 203
Posts |
Quote:
TIA!!
__________________
They followed me home...can I keep them?
Dan in Houston / CCA # 93849 |
|
Appreciate
0
|
07-17-2008, 02:13 PM | #18 | |
Major
36
Rep 1,329
Posts |
Quote:
jack up the car loosen the three nuts on the strut top. then use the good set of vise grips on alignment stud and twist. |
|
Appreciate
0
|
07-17-2008, 02:16 PM | #19 |
Lieutenant General
2146
Rep 10,176
Posts |
The pins are roughly threaded, like self tapping, but the hole on the strut hat is not threaded. You can use a allen wrench on it to unscrew it, but it twists out just as easily with a set of pliers/vicegrips.
|
Appreciate
0
|
07-17-2008, 02:26 PM | #20 | |
Major
36
Rep 1,329
Posts |
Quote:
Larry did you take yours out with the struts in the car or out. |
|
Appreciate
0
|
07-17-2008, 02:37 PM | #21 |
Lieutenant General
2146
Rep 10,176
Posts |
On my e90, they were in. On the e82, I believe they were out, or at least dropped (3 nuts undone, and front sway endlink disconnected, with car jacked). I did it at the same time as the springs.
|
Appreciate
0
|
Post Reply |
Bookmarks |
Thread Tools | Search this Thread |
|
|