i vs d

Nalod · 06-07-2009, 10:25 AM

Drove a non sport basic bones leatherette 335d and then a full loaded 335i fully swathed in hides and idrive wide screen goodness.

the d was crazy! Pulling 80mph at 2000 rpm is really funny. This car is fast, and the problem is in non sport you can't feel it. Like driving a town car! Im not saying thats bad! with the salesmen in tow I had it to 115 and the car was just so well poised doing its business very quietly.

dealer said they sold maybe one since its been out.

The 335i was more vicious in its persuit for speed and I liked it better. Question is the fuel economy and the overall reliablitly (one would project this with a diesel) is enough to call it a draw.

The diff between sport and non sport is with non sport you feel like your sitting on the car vs in the car. Maybe its the seats cuz my non sport 530i with the comfort seats (sport in 5 series language) has the same effect on me. Naturally the sport handled better.

In automatic form the 335 is point and shoot. Figue out where you want to be and slam the throttle and get there. No wonder its so easy to get into trouble. The d was also like that, just softer.

It would be good if more "d"s might chiime in on reliabilty issues if any with the motor and MPG experience. I'd hate to lose the MT choice as they don't offer that with the d.

BTW, to get my son to join me we first stopped at the Suby dealer for a long spin in a STI. That thing is crazy fast and sticks like crazy to the road. The thing had to be jumped as its not driven very much so the dealer was cool, just flipped me keys and said take our time. About an hours worth!

He is graduating high school today and in a moment of sentimental goodness the desire buy the car for him crossed my mind. Then the reality hit that its 35k, he has a very nice 2002 5mt 4cyl in great condition which he uses for work and hockey gear, and really giving even a responsable 18 yr old a car this fast is asking for big big trouble! He is pre-med in the fall and I did tease him that had he got that full ride to Duke I'd have made him the perfect freshman asshole stereotype by buying him the car!

That car is all about performance for the money but the funny thing is its the price of a much discusssed "loaner" leatherette 328i. Its a different animal all together. Nice looking thing and very fast, but the ride is crap for a 40ish year old driver.

In the end I think the most practical choice is 328i with MT and sport and get the 17's fitted with all seasons and not worry about $1400 tire changes and drive the car as its ment to be! I think a 2 week break in period in southern France and northern Italy next summer might be the best choice! Euro delivery looks like a great deal. I did the delivery in SC and enjoyed it. Regretted not doing the euro thing.

Just have to decide sedan, coupe or Touring. They are all great variants!

Saintor · 06-07-2009, 10:51 AM

Quote:

dealer said they sold maybe one since its been out.

Ouch.

Nalod · 06-07-2009, 10:58 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Saintor

Ouch.

If you consider the price premium of the motor and the fuel HAS been higher, its pretty easy to see why the i is the obvious choice.

DrGP · 06-07-2009, 11:06 AM

Car and driver did an analysis and calcualted that due to the high price of the 335d VS the 335i and 328i it would take 960,000 miles to break even over the 328 and 193,333 miles to break even over the 335i .(claculating gas @ $2.02/gal VS $2.32 for Diesel) NO BRAINER TO ME! . I think that when you compare the 335i to the diesel , the 335i is a definite winner. The 335i is a whole second faster 0-60. Gas mileage (19/ 28) of the 335i is very good when consider the performance you get. Unless you plan on keeping your car FOREVER, I don't get it. IMHO,The 328 is also a better choice although it is somewhat slower .

Nalod · 06-07-2009, 11:16 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DrGP

Car and driver did an analysis and calcualted that due to the high price of the 335d VS the 335i and 328i it would take 960,000 miles to break even over the 328 and 193,333 miles to break even over the 335i . NO BRAINER TO ME! . I think that when you compare the 335i to the diesel , the 335i is a definite winner. The 335i is a whole second faster 0-60. Gas mileage (19/ 28) of the 335i is very good when consider the performance you get. Unless you plan on keeping your car FOREVER, I don't get it. IMHO,The 328 is also a better choice although it is somewhat slower .

I read the article and agree with most of it. Im not planning on keeping it forever but enough that the i in turbo form might not be without its warts.

the d has been out in europe for some time and its problems or lack of might be more apparent.

At the time the article was written diesel was more expensive than premium petro so that hurt the comps.

I'd have to say the 335i is not gonna happen for me and like I said the diesel thing has more of a history of longevity. If diesel is to be more popular, and they do make more sense than hybrids, then the value retention of the d might be pretty good while used 335i's might not hold.

Its like the 335i has instant gratification and the hangover is the real, or potential wear items like the fuel pumps or the Turbos.

I'd lease a turbo. Not own.

Jim E. · 06-11-2009, 03:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bargamon

I read the article and agree with most of it. Im not planning on keeping it forever but enough that the i in turbo form might not be without its warts.

the d has been out in europe for some time and its problems or lack of might be more apparent.

At the time the article was written diesel was more expensive than premium petro so that hurt the comps.

I'd have to say the 335i is not gonna happen for me and like I said the diesel thing has more of a history of longevity. If diesel is to be more popular, and they do make more sense than hybrids, then the value retention of the d might be pretty good while used 335i's might not hold.

Its like the 335i has instant gratification and the hangover is the real, or potential wear items like the fuel pumps or the Turbos.

I'd lease a turbo. Not own.

Here is an interesting article comparing the 335d to the 335i: http://vivekk.bimmerpost.com//pics/BMW%20final.pdf

Surprisingly, or perhaps not, the 335d is faster on the track. Go figure.

Craig@SupremePower · 06-11-2009, 03:06 PM

i FTW!

BradF · 06-11-2009, 03:36 PM

Having owned a few diesels, the simple fact that it's a diesel should not be overlooked. Some people just like diesel cars. There's something about them. I think it's the torque....it's unbeatable.

Doing the math on a diesel is never going to get you there, you just have to appreciate them. I drove a 335d. It was bone stock with leatherette. Pretty boring, but that is one hell of an engine.

cstavaru · 06-11-2009, 04:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bargamon

Drove a non sport basic bones leatherette 335d and then a full loaded 335i fully swathed in hides and idrive wide screen goodness.

Which one felt faster to you ?

BMWE9X · 07-25-2009, 05:30 PM

Is it just as easy to work on diesels as it is to work on gasoline engines? I work on all my family's cars and they are all gas powered (3 E46s -->1 is an M3, 2 E90s) and don't have any experience with diesel engines. I'm not even sure the major difference in specific components other than diesels have glow plugs and gas engines have spark plugs. Can anyone with a tech background help? Thanks in advance!

GregL · 07-25-2009, 06:26 PM

I got a loaner R320 CDI from Mercedes once, despite the fact it weighs 1300lb more than my 330xi, it still managed slightly better fuel economy in city driving. I'm the type who hardly ever exceeds 3500rpm unless I'm on the highway and want to pass, so I really wouldn't miss having the 7000rpm redline that a gas car offers. For me, I'm going to try very hard to find an AWD diesel when I'm ready to replace my BMW.

tony20009 · 07-25-2009, 06:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DrGP

Car and driver did an analysis and calcualted that due to the high price of the 335d VS the 335i and 328i it would take 960,000 miles to break even over the 328 and 193,333 miles to break even over the 335i.

FWIW, there's a reasonable possibility that the diesel could actually last that long...diesels traditionally being such strong motors.

Xipher · 07-25-2009, 07:02 PM

I've had a (fully loaded) 335d for a about a month and a half now and absolutely love it. I've averaged around 37mpg so far with about 50/50 highway/city driving. I'm in Canada and diesel here is around 30cents per liter less than premium gas, which I believe that is a little over a dollar a gallon less in US figures.

Now that BMW US is offering a 4500$ ecocredit, it makes it that much more attractive, and essentially negates all the initial premium price for the d.

I just love the engineering with the combination of the power/ crazy amount of torque, efficiency, and the reduced emissions.

I haven't regretted my decision one bit, but of course that depends on each person.

stressdoc · 07-25-2009, 07:07 PM

I reiterate that the 335d was not the right choice for the USA market. The 323d or 330d would have undercut the 335i in price, and, in the case of the 323d, have made some huge PR points for BMW with the green crowd; imagine an ad with a E92 flying around a track, ending with a 'you can have your cake and eat it too -- introducing the 50mpg BMW'.

I think diesel hybrids are in our futures. A 1.2 litre diesel w/hybrid electric could have the performance of the 328 with 70+ mpg.

tony20009 · 07-25-2009, 07:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bargamon

Im not planning on keeping it forever ...
I'd have to say the 335i is not gonna happen for me and like I said the diesel thing has more of a history of longevity...
I'd lease a turbo. Not own.

Living is all about the journey. If you've not had a diesel before, go for it.

Personally, I'd BUY a diesel with the intent of keeping it for 15 years or so, but to each his own. Also, at least being about your age (a tad older actually, but...), I'd go ahead and try the diesel so that at least I have some experience with one if only because getting that experience stops having-a-diesel from being something "new and different."

Having aged parents, and hearing their peers' perceptions, I suspect that avoidance of things new and cool just goes with the territory of aging. Better to eliminate now as many things as possible that might be viewed as "different because it's not been experienced before" by the time you are 70ish/80ish. I don't think I'll be that way, but then again, recognizing that the human experience is quite a homogenous thing, I might just be that way...hmmm

listerone · 07-25-2009, 07:39 PM

As a newcomer to BMW (the 335d being my first) all I can say is that I'm enjoying it a lot.Although I'm not an agressive driver the torque when merging onto an Interstate is amazing.And on a recent 50 mile trip on I-90 *clear sailing all the way) the trip computer read 49.0 mpg at 65MPH.I do wish I has waited a few weeks to take advantage of the new $4,500 incentive but,hey....

For me a smaller,less expensive diesel will almost certainly be on my "must see" list in a few years when I'm ready to trade again...assuming one's available.

Quasimodem · 07-25-2009, 08:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by listerone

I do wish I has waited a few weeks to take advantage of the new $4,500 incentive but,hey....

NO KIDDING.

I would have had to wait a few months, but that isn't pocket change. And now the exclusivity is gone.

pruettfan · 07-25-2009, 09:10 PM

Diesel cars are like a Prius in the US market. It is a political or social statement about the myth that these cars are "greener". They are not but because the burn less fuel per mile they are seen as cleaner. As stated in the posts earlier you cannot make a good economic case for the 335d so it would come down to preference. In Europe there are all kinds of crazy taxes that make diesel models make more sense. BMW is trying to sell these cars here to help with the CAFE standards. To sell them however they will need to make them more attractive financially.

Quasimodem · 07-25-2009, 09:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pruettfan

Diesel cars are like a Prius in the US market. It is a political or social statement about the myth that these cars are "greener". They are not but because the burn less fuel per mile they are seen as cleaner.

Diesel cars are nothing like the Prius. MPG is about green alright, the green in my bank account. All other things being equal, more miles per gallon and lower price of diesel means more green in my pocket. I think the current price of diesel and the better MPG of the diesel is making some 335i owners green right now, green with envy. What is that second faster in the 0 to 60 worth?

Edit: Here is an interesting analysis of the Hybrid v. Diesel issue:
http://reviews.cnet.com/8301-13746_7-10274812-48.html

IDreamofBimmers · 07-26-2009, 07:46 AM

d FTW!!!

pruettfan · 07-26-2009, 01:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Quasimodem

Diesel cars are nothing like the Prius. MPG is about green alright, the green in my bank account. All other things being equal, more miles per gallon and lower price of diesel means more green in my pocket. I think the current price of diesel and the better MPG of the diesel is making some 335i owners green right now, green with envy. What is that second faster in the 0 to 60 worth?

Edit: Here is an interesting analysis of the Hybrid v. Diesel issue:
http://reviews.cnet.com/8301-13746_7-10274812-48.html

You need to brush up on your math skills. You pay substantially more for a diesel car, so there is no economic reason for a diesel car unless you are one of the 1% of americans that keep their cars for 200,000 miles. Personally I could care less what anyone else drives but it is irritating when they try and make an economic argument where there is none. Get a calculator my friend

Rando · 07-26-2009, 02:41 PM

As the OP points out, I think tire changes are a huge part of the equation when comparing the 335d to the 335i, or either of them with the 328i. The tires are at the limit all the time with the 335d and 335i... every time you are even in 2nd and just starting off... if you have full throttle, you are loading up the tires all the way from very low rpm... and those tires are expensive!

06-07-2009, 10:25 AM	#1
Nalod Major 79 Rep 1,073 Posts Drives: 2013 535i Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: NorthCarolina iTrader: (0)	i vs d Drove a non sport basic bones leatherette 335d and then a full loaded 335i fully swathed in hides and idrive wide screen goodness. the d was crazy! Pulling 80mph at 2000 rpm is really funny. This car is fast, and the problem is in non sport you can't feel it. Like driving a town car! Im not saying thats bad! with the salesmen in tow I had it to 115 and the car was just so well poised doing its business very quietly. dealer said they sold maybe one since its been out. The 335i was more vicious in its persuit for speed and I liked it better. Question is the fuel economy and the overall reliablitly (one would project this with a diesel) is enough to call it a draw. The diff between sport and non sport is with non sport you feel like your sitting on the car vs in the car. Maybe its the seats cuz my non sport 530i with the comfort seats (sport in 5 series language) has the same effect on me. Naturally the sport handled better. In automatic form the 335 is point and shoot. Figue out where you want to be and slam the throttle and get there. No wonder its so easy to get into trouble. The d was also like that, just softer. It would be good if more "d"s might chiime in on reliabilty issues if any with the motor and MPG experience. I'd hate to lose the MT choice as they don't offer that with the d. BTW, to get my son to join me we first stopped at the Suby dealer for a long spin in a STI. That thing is crazy fast and sticks like crazy to the road. The thing had to be jumped as its not driven very much so the dealer was cool, just flipped me keys and said take our time. About an hours worth! He is graduating high school today and in a moment of sentimental goodness the desire buy the car for him crossed my mind. Then the reality hit that its 35k, he has a very nice 2002 5mt 4cyl in great condition which he uses for work and hockey gear, and really giving even a responsable 18 yr old a car this fast is asking for big big trouble! He is pre-med in the fall and I did tease him that had he got that full ride to Duke I'd have made him the perfect freshman asshole stereotype by buying him the car! That car is all about performance for the money but the funny thing is its the price of a much discusssed "loaner" leatherette 328i. Its a different animal all together. Nice looking thing and very fast, but the ride is crap for a 40ish year old driver. In the end I think the most practical choice is 328i with MT and sport and get the 17's fitted with all seasons and not worry about $1400 tire changes and drive the car as its ment to be! I think a 2 week break in period in southern France and northern Italy next summer might be the best choice! Euro delivery looks like a great deal. I did the delivery in SC and enjoyed it. Regretted not doing the euro thing. Just have to decide sedan, coupe or Touring. They are all great variants!
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06-07-2009, 11:06 AM	#4
DrGP Lieutenant Colonel 137 Rep 1,914 Posts Drives: Sapphire 335i coupe Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: SE, PA iTrader: (0)	Car and driver did an analysis and calcualted that due to the high price of the 335d VS the 335i and 328i it would take 960,000 miles to break even over the 328 and 193,333 miles to break even over the 335i .(claculating gas @ $2.02/gal VS $2.32 for Diesel) NO BRAINER TO ME! . I think that when you compare the 335i to the diesel , the 335i is a definite winner. The 335i is a whole second faster 0-60. Gas mileage (19/ 28) of the 335i is very good when consider the performance you get. Unless you plan on keeping your car FOREVER, I don't get it. IMHO,The 328 is also a better choice although it is somewhat slower .
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06-11-2009, 03:06 PM	#7
Craig@SupremePower G.O.A.T.! 1000 Rep 74,998 Posts Drives: '18 GMC Yukon XL Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: New Jersey iTrader: (14)	i FTW!
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06-11-2009, 03:36 PM	#8
BradF Private First Class 8 Rep 150 Posts Drives: '06 E53, '08 E90 Join Date: Jul 2008 Location: CA iTrader: (0)	Having owned a few diesels, the simple fact that it's a diesel should not be overlooked. Some people just like diesel cars. There's something about them. I think it's the torque....it's unbeatable. Doing the math on a diesel is never going to get you there, you just have to appreciate them. I drove a 335d. It was bone stock with leatherette. Pretty boring, but that is one hell of an engine.
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07-25-2009, 05:30 PM	#10
BMWE9X New Member 0 Rep 16 Posts Drives: F30 328i sedan -- E46 M3 6MT Join Date: Jul 2009 Location: GA iTrader: (0)	Is it just as easy to work on diesels as it is to work on gasoline engines? I work on all my family's cars and they are all gas powered (3 E46s -->1 is an M3, 2 E90s) and don't have any experience with diesel engines. I'm not even sure the major difference in specific components other than diesels have glow plugs and gas engines have spark plugs. Can anyone with a tech background help? Thanks in advance!
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07-25-2009, 06:26 PM	#11
GregL Brigadier General 98 Rep 3,618 Posts Drives: 2016 CLA45 AMG Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: GTA iTrader: (4)	I got a loaner R320 CDI from Mercedes once, despite the fact it weighs 1300lb more than my 330xi, it still managed slightly better fuel economy in city driving. I'm the type who hardly ever exceeds 3500rpm unless I'm on the highway and want to pass, so I really wouldn't miss having the 7000rpm redline that a gas car offers. For me, I'm going to try very hard to find an AWD diesel when I'm ready to replace my BMW. __________________ 2016 Mercedes-AMG CLA45 2013 Mercedes-Benz B250 - Gone 2010 Mercedes-Benz C350 4Matic - Gone 2006 BMW 330xi - Gone 2001 Infiniti QX4 - Gone
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07-25-2009, 07:02 PM	#13
Xipher Private 2 Rep 54 Posts Drives: 2016 X5 35i Join Date: Jul 2009 Location: BC iTrader: (0)	I've had a (fully loaded) 335d for a about a month and a half now and absolutely love it. I've averaged around 37mpg so far with about 50/50 highway/city driving. I'm in Canada and diesel here is around 30cents per liter less than premium gas, which I believe that is a little over a dollar a gallon less in US figures. Now that BMW US is offering a 4500$ ecocredit, it makes it that much more attractive, and essentially negates all the initial premium price for the d. I just love the engineering with the combination of the power/ crazy amount of torque, efficiency, and the reduced emissions. I haven't regretted my decision one bit, but of course that depends on each person.
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07-25-2009, 07:07 PM	#14
stressdoc Moderator 618 Rep 10,855 Posts Drives: BMW i8; Toy 4runner TRD pro Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: Waco TX iTrader: (0)	I reiterate that the 335d was not the right choice for the USA market. The 323d or 330d would have undercut the 335i in price, and, in the case of the 323d, have made some huge PR points for BMW with the green crowd; imagine an ad with a E92 flying around a track, ending with a 'you can have your cake and eat it too -- introducing the 50mpg BMW'. I think diesel hybrids are in our futures. A 1.2 litre diesel w/hybrid electric could have the performance of the 328 with 70+ mpg. __________________ My recent ED photos: http://f80.bimmerpost.com/forums/sho....php?t=1026808 my not-so-recent ED: http://www.e90post.com/forums/showthread.php?t=31829 Please join BMWCCA http://bmwcca.org/index.php?pageid=c...&ref_by=300279
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07-25-2009, 07:39 PM	#16
listerone First Lieutenant 10 Rep 345 Posts Drives: 2018 BMW 540d Join Date: Jul 2009 Location: Connecticut iTrader: (0)	As a newcomer to BMW (the 335d being my first) all I can say is that I'm enjoying it a lot.Although I'm not an agressive driver the torque when merging onto an Interstate is amazing.And on a recent 50 mile trip on I-90 *clear sailing all the way) the trip computer read 49.0 mpg at 65MPH.I do wish I has waited a few weeks to take advantage of the new $4,500 incentive but,hey.... For me a smaller,less expensive diesel will almost certainly be on my "must see" list in a few years when I'm ready to trade again...assuming one's available.
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07-25-2009, 09:10 PM	#18
pruettfan Brigadier General 1622 Rep 3,402 Posts Drives: 2017 M2, LBB, DCT, Exec Join Date: Jul 2009 Location: Chandler, AZ iTrader: (0)	Diesel cars are like a Prius in the US market. It is a political or social statement about the myth that these cars are "greener". They are not but because the burn less fuel per mile they are seen as cleaner. As stated in the posts earlier you cannot make a good economic case for the 335d so it would come down to preference. In Europe there are all kinds of crazy taxes that make diesel models make more sense. BMW is trying to sell these cars here to help with the CAFE standards. To sell them however they will need to make them more attractive financially.
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07-26-2009, 07:46 AM	#20
IDreamofBimmers Captain 23 Rep 986 Posts Drives: 2008 VW GTI Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: Bethesda, MD iTrader: (0)	d FTW!!! __________________ 2008 VW GTI
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07-26-2009, 02:41 PM	#22
Rando Lieutenant 52 Rep 487 Posts Drives: BMW Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: CA iTrader: (0)	As the OP points out, I think tire changes are a huge part of the equation when comparing the 335d to the 335i, or either of them with the 328i. The tires are at the limit all the time with the 335d and 335i... every time you are even in 2nd and just starting off... if you have full throttle, you are loading up the tires all the way from very low rpm... and those tires are expensive!
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