Why does everyone who buys Borla go for the ATAK and not the S-type?

[Freiheit]

Early on in my M3 shopping I spent a lot of time listening to exhaust vids, and I settled on the Borla S-Type based on their marketing video. I felt it had a gorgeous, balanced tone, and it was "silvery" compared to every other sound out there. I also liked the Remus, Corsa, and AA mufflers but the Borla S-Type just stood head and shoulders above them all.

So I was pretty surprised to find that the S-Type was basically ignored on this forum, and I keep finding people either shopping for or bragging about their ATAK. I thought, based on the Borla marketing video, that the ATAK was too brassy and choppy and lacked any kind of refinement at all.

I'm going to experiment with a few mufflers, so ATAK owners... why did you pick that particular axle back?

[Dave07997S]

Tonal quality and drone. The ATAK is better in both instances.

Dave

[Mvy]

The BMW stock exhaust is pretty refined and quiet. It seems people interested in exhaust mods are trying to go the other way and make the car sound more rowdy and muscular. Hence going with the ATAK vs S type is the logical choice.

[Freiheit]

Originally Posted by Dave07997S

Tonal quality and drone. The ATAK is better in both instances.

The ATAK must sound totally different in person. The video I heard - which used some decent live mics - made the ATAK sound like a remote controlled fart box. It reminded me of how much I disliked the Borla exhaust I tried on my E46 M3.

[Freiheit]

Originally Posted by Mvy

The BMW stock exhaust is pretty refined and quiet. It seems people interested in exhaust mods are trying to go the other way and make the car sound more rowdy and muscular. Hence going with the ATAK vs S type is the logical choice.

I guess. I just think ATAK is a very simple sound. There's no nuance there.

[Mvy]

If you are experimenting with mufflers, and didnt like Borla, how about trying another brand like Magnaflow? Its deep and bassy, and with resonators added its a great option sound wise in my opinion.

[Freiheit]

Originally Posted by Mvy

If you are experimenting with mufflers, and didnt like Borla, how about trying another brand like Magnaflow? Its deep and bassy, and with resonators added its a great option sound wise in my opinion.

Its not that I didn't like Borla, I just didn't like the one that was on my S54 car. I like the sound of the Borla S-Type in the videos I've heard, so I'm just trying to figure out why no one uses it. Instead the consensus seems to be the ATAK, which sounds pretty bad IMO.

Magnaflow is an option, but if Borla S is rare, Magnaflow is non-existent. I don't think I've even heard it in a video. You say its bassy - does that bass give you any kind of hum at any rpm?

[Mvy]

Originally Posted by Freiheit

Its not that I didn't like Borla, I just didn't like the one that was on my S54 car. I like the sound of the Borla S-Type in the videos I've heard, so I'm just trying to figure out why no one uses it. Instead the consensus seems to be the ATAK, which sounds pretty bad IMO.

Magnaflow is an option, but if Borla S is rare, Magnaflow is non-existent. I don't think I've even heard it in a video. You say its bassy - does that bass give you any kind of hum at any rpm?

Not sure what you mean, but Magnaflow is a very respected and widely used exhaust system on many sports cars. You can find a ton of you tube videos if you search magnaflow on an m3.

Its so hard to internet shop for an exaust! I'd caution you not to make a buying decision based on videos alone. You know how different it can sound in person.
All exhaust systems I have heard or tried have some drone. Magnaflow is no different but I dont find it overbearing. My setup is supercharged so exhaust notes are muted due to the intake noises.

[Helmsman]

Congrats on the new exhaust Freiheit, glad you like it! Personally couldn't stand the S system, the bass literally killed my ears...to sensitive I guess...

Here's my thoughts for what its worth: https://www.m3post.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1457106

As mentioned back to OEM (un modded) since some time and really enjoy it for now.

[typhoon711]

I have the S and love the sound. I wanted something with a deeper tone and it fits that. There is some drone at around 2,000 rpm, but it isn’t bad. The car isn’t my daily driver anymore, so I’m not concerned about that too much.

[shimmy23]

Originally Posted by Mvy

If you are experimenting with mufflers, and didnt like Borla, how about trying another brand like Magnaflow? Its deep and bassy, and with resonators added its a great option sound wise in my opinion.

I ran a MF. Sounded great but droned too much.

[Mvy]

Originally Posted by shimmy23

I ran a MF. Sounded great but droned too much.

Originally Posted by shimmy23

I ran a MF. Sounded great but droned too much.

Did you have resonators? That helps with drone.

[Dlpfcb]

Becausre the atak sounds the best of the borla options. If I'm gonna drop the kind of money we all do on exhaust setups then I want to really hear it. I see it as why drop $2 - 4k on an exhaust to have it be just a tad louder.

[Freiheit]

Originally Posted by Mvy

Not sure what you mean, but Magnaflow is a very respected and widely used exhaust system on many sports cars. You can find a ton of you tube videos if you search magnaflow on an m3.

I wasn't saying Magnaflow was a non-entity- I know those guys, and have spent a lot of time talking with them a few years back regarding other projects. What I meant was I hadn't heard any vids of their exhaust on the E92 M3. They weren't on the BodMargains (gotta bowdlerize otherwise the forum software censors their name for some reasons) exhaust compilation video, and I hadn't found any quality videos with Magnaflow installed.

Originally Posted by Mvy

Its so hard to internet shop for an exaust! I'd caution you not to make a buying decision based on videos alone. You know how different it can sound in person.
All exhaust systems I have heard or tried have some drone. Magnaflow is no different but I dont find it overbearing. My setup is supercharged so exhaust notes are muted due to the intake noises.

It is a problem shopping for exhaust online. About all you can really be sure of is the material quality (via the ad text) and the build quality (via pics). Sounds can be manipulated. Even Borla is no stranger to this, as their vids clearly have audio done separately and then mixed into the video. Watch their comparison video and you can see the guy is driving a manual but the audio has DCT shifting.

Regarding the Borla videos, one thing I want to call attention to is that they proudly proclaim there is no resonance in 6th gear at a particular rpm, I think it was 2700 at 65mph? Thats great. What about 2k at 50mph? What about 3k at 80mph in 7th? My Remus has a sinus-shaking hum at that rpm. Its easy to avoid, but lately I've found myself cruising at that speed and it makes me want to play around with the exhaust some more.

[Freiheit]

Originally Posted by Dlpfcb

Becausre the atak sounds the best of the borla options. If I'm gonna drop the kind of money we all do on exhaust setups then I want to really hear it. I see it as why drop $2 - 4k on an exhaust to have it be just a tad louder.

So... loud means "best" to you? It doesn't work that way for everyone.

Going simply by the videos I've heard - including the Borla video - I find the ATAK to be loud, brassy, and lacking in nuance. I have yet to hear it in person, so my opinion may change. However, this thread is about what made people decide to buy it, and I'm sure most people bought it without hearing it in person, so I'm trying to figure out what "did it" for them.

Personally, I think it was somewhat psychological. Borla put the ATAK entry last in the video comparison, so many people subconsciously felt that it was "best", or somehow the badass, meant for off-road use only, choice. I bet if they had done that video with the order being ATAK, Touring, S-Type, there'd be a lot more S-Type on the market.

[Helmsman]

Hey, sounds like you answered your own question mate, done.

[Freiheit]

Originally Posted by Helmsman

Hey, sounds like you answered your own question mate, done.

I know, right? Why couldn't I have been that smart a week ago?

If I read your stuff correctly - and I'd like to think I did - you're completely stock on your exhaust now?

[Freiheit]

Originally Posted by typhoon711

I have the S and love the sound. I wanted something with a deeper tone and it fits that. There is some drone at around 2,000 rpm, but it isn’t bad. The car isn’t my daily driver anymore, so I’m not concerned about that too much.

Do you ever get down to the central parts of our state? I'd like to hear that system in person.

[deansbimmer]

Shopping for exhausts is like shopping for shoes. It's 100% personal. It's why there are a hundred companies making M3 exhausts, and people buy all of them.

Not only are people's tastes different, consider that not everyone's hearing is the same on a medical level. One person may perceive tonal frequencies or decibels differently than the next, and have differing sensitivities.

If you relied on the marketing department's depiction of each company's product, you'd want to buy all of them and would never reach a decision. You can't really tell about an exhaust from a video. Mic's don't pick up low frequencies or decibel context well.

Nobody has heard every exhaust in person to determine a "winner". Even if they did their assertion would be subject to their personal tastes.

For these reasons, the only "best" exhaust is the exhaust which pleases your senses the most. Asking other people's opinions will only get you so far...And probably start a heated debate.

[Freiheit]

Originally Posted by deansbimmer

Shopping for exhausts is like shopping for shoes. It's 100% personal. It's why there are a hundred companies making M3 exhausts, and people buy all of them.

Not only are people's tastes different, consider that not everyone's hearing is the same on a medical level. One person may perceive tonal frequencies or decibels differently than the next, and have differing sensitivities.

If you relied on the marketing department's depiction of each company's product, you'd want to buy all of them and would never reach a decision. You can't really tell about an exhaust from a video. Mic's don't pick up low frequencies or decibel context well.

Nobody has heard every exhaust in person to determine a "winner". Even if they did their assertion would be subject to their personal tastes.

For these reasons, the only "best" exhaust is the exhaust which pleases your senses the most.

QFT.

Thats why I was just asking why people chose the one over the other, not asking which was best.

Off to the side: did you ever notice that there's usually more exhausts for a given M3 than there are for both the Camaro and Mustang contemporary models combined? I think at last count there was over twenty different models available for the E46, and a similar number for the E9x.

[deansbimmer]

Originally Posted by Freiheit

Off to the side: did you ever notice that there's usually more exhausts for a given M3 than there are for both the Camaro and Mustang contemporary models combined? I think at last count there was over twenty different models available for the E46, and a similar number for the E9x.

I'm going to go out on a limb here and suggest that M3 owners have a more refined aural palate than a typical Domestic Iron owner. Given that the first order of business for just about every Mustang owner is to slap in straight pipes, I suspect most American car buyers just believe that louder is better. *flame suit on*

[Freiheit]

Originally Posted by BrewRifle

QFT? No reason to be a prick, son.

What?