SIB info for M-DCT S/W upgrade

[apw2607]

Updated with additional SI B.

Attached is also the PROGMAN info.

SI B28 06 08

Double-clutch Transmission with Drivelogic October 2008

Technical Service

PERFORM THE PROCEDURE OUTLINED IN THIS SERVICE INFORMATION ON ALL AFFECTED VEHICLES PRIOR TO CUSTOMER DELIVERY OR THE NEXT TIME THEY ARE IN THE SHOP FOR MAINTENANCE OR REPAIRS.


SUBJECT
Service Action: M3 with M DCT – Reprogramming for Incorrect DCT Clutch Operation


MODEL
E90, E92, E93 M3 with S65 and M DCT transmission produced up to 09/10/08


SITUATION
Due to the M DCT software error, the customer may experience a sudden loss of engine power when decelerating to a complete stop with light brake application, or when performing a multistage downshift (e.g. from 5th to 2nd gear, or from 6th to 3rd gear). At the same time, the transmission will shift into neutral, and reduced power steering assist will be detected.

In order to correct this situation, BMW is conducting a Service Action to reprogram the M DCT transmission control module on all affected vehicles. With the completion of this Service Action, the software of the complete vehicle will be updated as described in SI B09 05 01 (Coding, Individualization, Programming), Procedure B.

AFFECTED VEHICLES
This Service Action involves M3 vehicles with the S65 engine and M DCT (dual clutch) transmissions, produced from series introduction up to 09/10/08.

In order to determine whether a specific vehicle is affected by this Service Action, it will be necessary to utilize the "Service Menu" of DCSnet (Dealer Communication System) or the Key Reader. Based on the response of the system, either proceed with the corrective action or take no further action.

The chassis number ranges listed below are only for informational purposes, and are not to be considered as the only deciding factor.

Model
Chassis Number Range

M3 Sedan
E201016 – E201024

E216016 – E216265

M3 Coupe
PY40477 – PY43362

M3 Convertible
P330455 – P331741

PROCEDURE
Reprogram and recode the complete vehicle using Progman V31.1 or higher (target integration level of E89x-08-09-520 or higher).




SI B 28 05 08

Double-clutch Transmission with Drivelogic October 2008

Technical Service

SUBJECT
M3 with DCT with Drivelogic – Gearbox Emergency Program with FC 5060


MODEL
E90, E92, E93 M3 with S65 and Double-clutch Transmission produced up to 09/08


SITUATION
The customer may complain that intermittently the red "Gearbox Emergency Program" indicator is displayed in the cluster or in the CC. The fault code 5060 ("Parking lock – electrical fault at the parking lock magnet") is stored in the DCT transmission control module, in conjunction with the CAS fault A0B1 (Input selector lever position – implausible).

CAUSE
DCT software error

SOLUTION
On a customer complaint basis only, check the vehicle's integration level.

If the integration level is E89x-08-03-540 or lower, then reprogram and/or recode the complete vehicle with a current Progman version (target integration level is E89x-08-09-515 or higher, available since the release of Progman V31).

WARRANTY INFORMATION
Covered under the terms of the BMW New Vehicle Limited Warranty or the Certified Pre-Owned Program.

Defect Code:
28 00 02 98 00


Labor Operation:
Labor Allowance:
Description:

61 00 801
7 FRU
Programming coding modules without CAS


61 00 811
8 FRU
Programming coding modules including CAS

[Battle]

So is this the fix for the lag? Thanks.

[BMWguy206]

Originally Posted by ArsenalFC

So is this the fix for the lag? Thanks.

According to the bulletin no it does not but it might and BMW just didn't want to have it printed because they know a copy of the bulletin will be posted on the internet.

BTW, depending on the dealer or who's working on your M3, if the DCT Control unit does NOT have those two faults there is a chance that they will not upload the new software.

Reason is because BMW will ask for copies of the fault codes along with the repair order/invoice and if it doesn't match with the bulletin then BMW NA will not pay the dealer for doing the work and might be audited.

However, there are a couple of ways to go around this if the tech is smart enough and wants to get paid for doing the work.

[mkoesel]

Thanks for posting this. I wonder if it is generally possible (i.e. part of standard procedure) to get the upgrade without having to exhibit the faults listed in the "situation" paragraph?

[BMWguy206]

Originally Posted by mkoesel

Thanks for posting this. I wonder if it is generally possible (i.e. part of standard procedure) to get the upgrade without having to exhibit the faults listed in the "situation" paragraph?

Yes it's possible.

[Blake]

Originally Posted by mkoesel

Thanks for posting this. I wonder if it is generally possible (i.e. part of standard procedure) to get the upgrade without having to exhibit the faults listed in the "situation" paragraph?

what my SA told me was to complain of stalling at a hard stop. it's something that is not easily reproduced sometimes. my SA is cool, he did all that for me, but told me to let everyone know that would be the instant qualification due to it being a safety issue. but he also said that if they just accepted every single DCT m3 out there for a reprogram, they would be inundated with requests, which is why you have to specifically complain about 1 of those 2 things. hope this helps...

[nusevad]

If this doesnt solve the lag issue then I think its pointless to update esp. if you have no problems. If it aint broken, dont fix it.

[mkoesel]

Originally Posted by blakepilot

what my SA told me was to complain of stalling at a hard stop. it's something that is not easily reproduced sometimes. my SA is cool, he did all that for me, but told me to let everyone know that would be the instant qualification due to it being a safety issue. but he also said that if they just accepted every single DCT m3 out there for a reprogram, they would be inundated with requests, which is why you have to specifically complain about 1 of those 2 things. hope this helps...

Thanks blakepilot - that's actually a very helpful post. I was considering that approach but had wondered if the data logger could be used to prove I was lying. The last thing I want to do is get in a pissing match with the service department when they have all the cards. I imagine some service dept's will probably deny the service to update the software if they think you are bullshitting them.

And I do sort of understand about the CA's point also. Although, like I said in another thread, I think BMW NA should really give this to everyone due to the potential safety issue. That would certainly make things easier and avoid this little game that we are currently forced to play. Of course, I should expect nothing less from BMW NA since they typically favor running their business with the maximum amount of discomfort falling on the customer.

[mkoesel]

Originally Posted by FifthStreetz

If this doesnt solve the lag issue then I think its pointless to update esp. if you have no problems. If it aint broken, dont fix it.

Well, we know that there is some update in existence that solves the lag issue. Is it this particular update? Good question. It seems likely that it is. Tim has reported his lag is gone with PROGMAN 31.1.

[Blake]

Originally Posted by mkoesel

Thanks blakepilot - that's actually a very helpful post. I was considering that approach but had wondered if the data logger could be used to prove I was lying. The last thing I want to do is get is a pissing match with the service department when they have all the cards. I imagine some service dept's will probably deny the service to update the software if they think you are bullshitting them.

And I do sort of understand about the CA's point also. Although, like I said in another thread, I think BMW NA should really give this to everyone due to the potential safety issue. That would certainly make things easier and avoid this little game that we are currently forced to play. Of course, I should expect nothing less from BMW NA since they typically favor running their business with the maximum amount of discomfort falling on the customer.

a couple things...the data logger on board the m3 logs only what happens in the moments before a collision, if i'm not mistaken. they can't deny you for any reason that is potential safety hazard. they have to take it as a serious request...what if you weren't lying, you stalled in an intersection, and got broadsided by a speeding 18-wheeler? major liability for the dealership, especially given the fact a TSB was issued on it. if you were killed in that hypothetical accident, all kinds of investigations would occur, and there might be a chance that the denial of that upgrade could be found to be the cause of that accident. not everyone has had stalling issues, but they have to cover their ass for the ones that have.

[mkoesel]

Originally Posted by blakepilot

a couple things...the data logger on board the m3 logs only what happens in the moments before a collision, if i'm not mistaken.

That may very well be, although I know in the last thread about this there was some debate about the logger. All I know for sure is that it is there and it stores lots and lots of numbers.

they can't deny you for any reason that is potential safety hazard. they have to take it as a serious request...what if you weren't lying, you stalled in an intersection, and got broadsided by a speeding 18-wheeler? major liability for the dealership, especially given the fact a TSB was issued on it. if you were killed in that hypothetical accident, all kinds of investigations would occur, and there might be a chance that the denial of that upgrade could be found to be the cause of that accident. not everyone has had stalling issues, but they have to cover their ass for the ones that have.

I definitely hear you. Your logic sits very well with me. But there are plenty of irrational people out there and I don't know about you but I notice that many of them seem to seek out the automotive sales and service industry as their profession.

In my mind BMW NA themselves are already in a sense treading on thin ice as far as liability by not simply issuing an official recall. It really does not matter - to me at least - that only some people have seen this issue personally. Unless there is something mystersious, BMW should already know which cars are effected by this, and just have those people come in and get the fix. By not doing so they are specifically not covering their ass, at least in appearance. From a legal standpoint I suppose their staff has already told them that its far within their rights to take a wait and see on this, and probably they believe it will hold up in court if anyone does get injured. Although to me that seems terminally irresponsible if in fact that really is, or resembles, their current stance on things.

[Blake]

Originally Posted by mkoesel

That may very well be, although I know in the last thread about this there was some debate about the logger. All I know for sure is that it is there and it stores lots and lots of numbers.

well at the minimum, there is logging about conditions before and up to a collision. things like engine conditions, speed at the time of impact, airbag deployment, sensors, and gizmos are the minimum in the data logger. i personally don't buy into the big brother thing with BMW. nissan...different story, but i shall not digress.

I definitely hear you. Your logic sits very well with me. But there are plenty of irrational people out there and I don't know about you but I notice that many of them seem to seek out the automotive sales and service industry as their profession.

there are some nutjobs in the automotive industry, but i'm drawing my logic from my training as a commercial pilot. the dealership, as with any entity involved in the repair of vehicles, planes, etc., is required by law to diagnose and fix any major safety concern stated by the operator...ESPECIALLY because there is a known fix! they can't just snub you because they think you're lying. they aren't the judge and jury. and if they do, i bet one call to the DOT/NTSB or BMWNA would quickly remedy that. transportation safety code is pretty much universal. being that we know there is a data logger present, the NTSB can easily scan through it to see what transpired moments before impact and if a customer complained update was not done because of contempt by the maintaining body, that is a big no-no.

In my mind BMW NA themselves are already in a sense treading on thin ice as far as liability by not simply issuing an official recall.

time and money. if they issued a recall, then there would be thousands of cars lined up waiting for this upgrade. this reflash isn't an in and out procedure either. my SA told me it takes hours to complete. another reason is this isn't a widespread problem. forum junkies know about it because we discuss and test it ad nausium.

It really does not matter - to me at least - that only some people have seen this issue personally. Unless there is something mystersious, BMW should already know which cars are effected by this, and just have those people come in and get the fix. By not doing so they are specifically not covering their ass, at least in appearance. From a legal standpoint I suppose their staff has already told them that its far within their rights to take a wait and see on this, and probably they believe it will hold up in court if anyone does get injured. Although to me that seems terminally irresponsible if in fact that really is, or resembles, their current stance on things.

time and money again. no one has died because of this yet, that we know of, so they can just do it on a complaint basis. my situation in the previous post was a little extreme, but not outside the realm of possibilities. now if someone wants to be the guinea pig and sacrifice their life for us, then i'm sure we could get a recall issued...but i don't think anyone wants to be that test dummy.

again, i could be wrong about a number of things, but i'm drawing from my extensive training in transportation safety code and dealing with car/aviation repair companies. similar things exist in aviation. you just can't snub a customer with a serious safety complaint on something that isn't technically just supposed to just stall out.

[Sticky]

Originally Posted by blakepilot

what my SA told me was to complain of stalling at a hard stop. it's something that is not easily reproduced sometimes. my SA is cool, he did all that for me, but told me to let everyone know that would be the instant qualification due to it being a safety issue. but he also said that if they just accepted every single DCT m3 out there for a reprogram, they would be inundated with requests, which is why you have to specifically complain about 1 of those 2 things. hope this helps...

Thanks for the tip, I am going to raise holy hell regarding stalling and I better get my update or I am just going to leave my car there like GT3 Tim.

[Sticky]

Originally Posted by FifthStreetz

If this doesnt solve the lag issue then I think its pointless to update esp. if you have no problems. If it aint broken, dont fix it.

I agree, if it doesn't solve the lag what is the point? According to those who got the update, it DOES solve the lag though.

[mkoesel]

Originally Posted by blakepilot

well at the minimum, there is logging about conditions before and up to a collision. things like engine conditions, speed at the time of impact, airbag deployment, sensors, and gizmos are the minimum in the data logger. i personally don't buy into the big brother thing with BMW. nissan...different story, but i shall not digress.

Right, I just wonder how much more is logged. I am sure it must log overrevs for example so they can void warranties for money shifts. Probably logs other things too like excessive lateral force or maybe rev-limiter or speed-limiter hits.

again, i could be wrong about a number of things, but i'm drawing from my extensive training in transportation safety code and dealing with car/aviation repair companies. similar things exist in aviation. you just can't snub a customer with a serious safety complaint on something that isn't technically just supposed to just stall out.

All fair points. I still have a hard time with the reasoning that the BMW dealership has a stronger legal obligation to fix the car if I ask them to than BMW NA itself has to simply fix all cars with known problems to begin with (which may very well be only a subset of all the M-DCT cars in the US). To me BMW NA's choice to leave it to dealership rather than issuing a recall as has been done in other countries leaves them at risk for litigation regardless of whether someone has died or been injured yet.

Nevertheless I do agree that telling the dealership that my car has stalled is probably the path of least resistance and is the right move to make in BMW NA's little game of capture-the-update. I will be doing just that in the near future. I'll probably wait a week or two to see how others fare using this strategy (or other strategies they come up with).

[apw2607]

Heres another one ....

SI B28 06 08

Double-clutch Transmission with Drivelogic October 2008

Technical Service

PERFORM THE PROCEDURE OUTLINED IN THIS SERVICE INFORMATION ON ALL AFFECTED VEHICLES PRIOR TO CUSTOMER DELIVERY OR THE NEXT TIME THEY ARE IN THE SHOP FOR MAINTENANCE OR REPAIRS.


SUBJECT
Service Action: M3 with M DCT – Reprogramming for Incorrect DCT Clutch Operation


MODEL
E90, E92, E93 M3 with S65 and M DCT transmission produced up to 09/10/08


SITUATION
Due to the M DCT software error, the customer may experience a sudden loss of engine power when decelerating to a complete stop with light brake application, or when performing a multistage downshift (e.g. from 5th to 2nd gear, or from 6th to 3rd gear). At the same time, the transmission will shift into neutral, and reduced power steering assist will be detected.

In order to correct this situation, BMW is conducting a Service Action to reprogram the M DCT transmission control module on all affected vehicles. With the completion of this Service Action, the software of the complete vehicle will be updated as described in SI B09 05 01 (Coding, Individualization, Programming), Procedure B.

AFFECTED VEHICLES
This Service Action involves M3 vehicles with the S65 engine and M DCT (dual clutch) transmissions, produced from series introduction up to 09/10/08.

In order to determine whether a specific vehicle is affected by this Service Action, it will be necessary to utilize the "Service Menu" of DCSnet (Dealer Communication System) or the Key Reader. Based on the response of the system, either proceed with the corrective action or take no further action.

The chassis number ranges listed below are only for informational purposes, and are not to be considered as the only deciding factor.

Model
Chassis Number Range

M3 Sedan
E201016 – E201024

E216016 – E216265

M3 Coupe
PY40477 – PY43362

M3 Convertible
P330455 – P331741

PROCEDURE
Reprogram and recode the complete vehicle using Progman V31.1 or higher (target integration level of E89x-08-09-520 or higher).

[Blake]

^^^ settled

[Z4dave]

Originally Posted by apw2607

Heres another one ....

SI B28 06 08

PROCEDURE
Reprogram and recode the complete vehicle using Progman V31.1 or higher (target integration level of E89x-08-09-520 or higher).

Will this work at a US dealer?

[BMWguy206]

Originally Posted by Z4dave

Will this work at a US dealer?

Yes it will.

[Blake]

Originally Posted by Z4dave

Will this work at a US dealer?

this is an exact quote from an email from my SA:

That’s a new programming recall that is not active yet on your car. Either way all it needs is the most updated progman program.

See you Monday!!

[apw2607]

We like to be first with the news at m3post guys :-)

[mkoesel]

PERFORM THE PROCEDURE OUTLINED IN THIS SERVICE INFORMATION ON ALL AFFECTED VEHICLES PRIOR TO CUSTOMER DELIVERY OR THE NEXT TIME THEY ARE IN THE SHOP FOR MAINTENANCE OR REPAIRS.

Ok well that's a little better, now we don't have to lie, cheat, steal, or beg our way to getting the update.

But we still need an excuse to take the car in, I suppose. Realistically though I am hoping means that getting the software is just an easy phone call away.