Going FBO soon need help on a tune...

[Zombie1]

What's up guys I have a 2010-135i auto. I'm going FBO soon and I want to get my car to run mid 12s all day at the track. So. MY question is should I just get a pro tune done? should I drop the COBB and pick up a JB? What about a backend flash is it worth it if I'm not running meth? Any help is appreciated thanks gents

[135Pats]

There’s a lot to consider here, we need more context regarding your goals first

When you say mid 12s, what are we doing on the fuel side? Are you committed to sticking with pump gas? FBO with the proper octane will get you those numbers absolutely no problem.

I prefer flash tuning, but that’s a large discussion and I’m too lazy to type out why I find it preferable. Do some searching and draw your own conclusions there. I’d just say that I don’t like feeding the DME imaginary targets while hijacking the CAN. But a lot of JB4 users have had very strong results and Terry makes awesome products, there is no disputing that.

The backend flash for JB users is solely to overcome the inherent shortcomings of piggyback tuning. The JB does a very nice job controlling boost, but it cannot advance timing, nor can it handle fueling particularly well. So flashing on the fueling and timing side while using the JB to handle boost is what most of those guys do. Since you are starting with a flash tune, there is no need. You already have a “backend flash” in your Accessport.

[Zombie1]

Originally Posted by 135Pats

There’s a lot to consider here, we need more context regarding your goals first

When you say mid 12s, what are we doing on the fuel side? Are you committed to sticking with pump gas? FBO with the proper octane will get you those numbers absolutely no problem.

I prefer flash tuning, but that’s a large discussion and I’m too lazy to type out why I find it preferable. Do some searching and draw your own conclusions there. I’d just say that I don’t like feeding the DME imaginary targets while hijacking the CAN. But a lot of JB4 users have had very strong results and Terry makes awesome products, there is no disputing that.

The backend flash for JB users is solely to overcome the inherent shortcomings of piggyback tuning. The JB does a very nice job controlling boost, but it cannot advance timing, nor can it handle fueling particularly well. So flashing on the fueling and timing side while using the JB to handle boost is what most of those guys do. Since you are starting with a flash tune, there is no need. You already have a “backend flash” in your Accessport.

Yeah I want to stay away from e85 and meth all together as I plan on keeping the car till it dies. If I do get a protune I'd get a map for 93 and another map made for 100octane. I plan on also doing an LSD but that's a long ways off. Thanks for the input sir.

[Colt]

I've had both JB4 and COBB. I prefer COBB because of the protuning option. As Pats said, the idea of flash tuning is better on my mind (personally) and you can easily get another map added for different fuel if you wanted to. And you already have the COBB so....

[135Pats]

If you wanted to add meth you could stack Cobb with the PROcede, that would get you some really nice results. You could do the same with the JB but two things concern me with stacking that combo + meth
1. The Vishnu PWM meth kit is just better than the BMS kit. End of story.
2. JB is not truly passive; it will always attempt to feed the DME signals. PROcede can be completely passive with regards to timing and fueling; the flash will handle that portion of the equation on its own.
But since you are just going with pump gas and already have Cobb, just stick with that.

[RnmEvo9]

If your goal is just mid 12's, Cobbs OTS Stage 2+ should get you right there. With Stage 2+ aggressive 93 octane, downpipes and fmic, I ran a 12.3@117mph with a terrible 2.171 60ft.

[Zombie1]

Originally Posted by RnmEvo9

If your goal is just mid 12's, Cobbs OTS Stage 2+ should get you right there. With Stage 2+ aggressive 93 octane, downpipes and fmic, I ran a 12.3@117mph with a terrible 2.171 60ft.

If I can get that with just OTS maps I wonder if it's worth going for the pro tune? What tires are you on? Are you auto or manual? Thanks

[Ginger_Extract]

Combos to run mid-12's:
- tune + drag radials
- tune + basic bolt ons + street tires

Especially with the AT, you'll be running mid 12's all day. Throw some Mickey Thompsons on there and call it done. I went 13.1 bone stock with RFTs, and 12.9 with a tune, damn near blowing the tires off despite rolling it off the line with an idle launch. My numbers are with MT as well.

[RnmEvo9]

Originally Posted by Zombie1

If I can get that with just OTS maps I wonder if it's worth going for the pro tune? What tires are you on? Are you auto or manual? Thanks

It's an auto and I ran that with stock runflats. Currently I'm on michelin pilot super sports but haven't gone to the drag strip since.

[greensto]

Why stay away from e85? JB4 plus a few gallons of e85 in the mix has shown to yeild substantial gains with adaptive mapping and will get you to your number easily without even having to spend money on bolt-ons. But... as we all know, the mod bug will keep you going.... Just saying, a few gallons of e85 won't ruin anything. I have been running a 30/70 mix for the last year without problem while other guys have been running 50/50 for years without a hiccup other than an occasional lean code.

[Dmacc]

Originally Posted by greensto

Why stay away from e85? JB4 plus a few gallons of e85 in the mix has shown to yeild substantial gains with adaptive mapping and will get you to your number easily without even having to spend money on bolt-ons. But... as we all know, the mod bug will keep you going.... Just saying, a few gallons of e85 won't ruin anything. I have been running a 30/70 mix for the last year without problem while other guys have been running 50/50 for years without a hiccup other than an occasional lean code.

I believe he is afraid of the lack of a common consensus of whether or not e85 does damage to our car's fuel system or not. I would feel the same way if I planned to keep my car until it's death. But I agree, a decent mix of e85 will yield those times all day.

[Zombie1]

Originally Posted by Dmacc

I believe he is afraid of the lack of a common consensus of whether or not e85 does damage to our car's fuel system or not. I would feel the same way if I planned to keep my car until it's death. But I agree, a decent mix of e85 will yield those times all day.

Yeah that's how I feel, my buddy has a 335 he runs a e30 map it's a beast but he's only been doing it for a month now. I'm just worried about what you said how damaging it is to our fuel systems et

[Stohlen]

Originally Posted by greensto

Why stay away from e85? JB4 plus a few gallons of e85 in the mix has shown to yeild substantial gains with adaptive mapping and will get you to your number easily without even having to spend money on bolt-ons. But... as we all know, the mod bug will keep you going.... Just saying, a few gallons of e85 won't ruin anything. I have been running a 30/70 mix for the last year without problem while other guys have been running 50/50 for years without a hiccup other than an occasional lean code.

1. an occasional lean code is a big deal... It only takes one lean incident to destroy a motor.

2. No adaptive mapping will be safe, the car has no idea that you're feeding it E85 and thus it will not be properly safe compared to a pro-tune specifically for e-85

[greensto]

Originally Posted by Stohlen

1. an occasional lean code is a big deal... It only takes one lean incident to destroy a motor.

2. No adaptive mapping will be safe, the car has no idea that you're feeding it E85 and thus it will not be properly safe compared to a pro-tune specifically for e-85

The Jb4 will cut boost if any code like that is even thrown. Saying that "no adaptive mapping will be safe" is PRETTY presumptuous. I don't know of too many people on here having problems with Terry's adaptive mapping. Map 5 adjusts itself for IAT, fuel octane (including e85), and molds to your driving habits. Overall, I've had great results with my Map 5 with a 35/65 e85 mix.

[Stohlen]

Originally Posted by greensto

The Jb4 will cut boost if any code like that is even thrown. Saying that "no adaptive mapping will be safe" is PRETTY presumptuous. I don't know of too many people on here having problems with Terry's adaptive mapping. Map 5 adjusts itself for IAT, fuel octane (including e85), and molds to your driving habits. Overall, I've had great results with my Map 5 with a 35/65 e85 mix.

Terry's product is great, and the ECU in the BMW is also great and has alot of safeguards in place to prevent engine damage... But adaptive mapping will never produce as much horsepower/torque as a custom flash tune, nor will it ever be as safe because you are not telling it what to do. It doesn't know what your octane is and is just guessing/tricking the ecu to do what it wants. ITs a very good product but will never be as safe as a flash tune.

Also the JB4 cutting boost if a code is thrown doesn't do anything but prevent further lean events from happening when a problem occurs. The first lean event has already occured and it only takes one to blow a motor.

[greensto]

Originally Posted by Stohlen

Terry's product is great, and the ECU in the BMW is also great and has alot of safeguards in place to prevent engine damage... But adaptive mapping will never produce as much horsepower/torque as a custom flash tune, nor will it ever be as safe because you are not telling it what to do. It doesn't know what your octane is and is just guessing/tricking the ecu to do what it wants. ITs a very good product but will never be as safe as a flash tune.

Also the JB4 cutting boost if a code is thrown doesn't do anything but prevent further lean events from happening when a problem occurs. The first lean event has already occured and it only takes one to blow a motor.

Do you have an example of someone with 1 lean code that has blown a motor? I find that statement ridiculous (no offense)

[Stohlen]

Originally Posted by greensto

Do you have an example of someone with 1 lean code that has blown a motor? I find that statement ridiculous (no offense)

If you find it ridiculous you don't really understand how a motor works.

Our motors are very overbuilt, hardly any catastrophic failures to speak of which is why i bought the car. But the number of turbo failures due to tuning is huge. Its impossible to tell what caused a failure unless you're logging during the event, but logs from the JB4 are much more corrective than the flash tuning systems. The JB4 is like playing a game of pong where the values jump back and forth from what i've seen.

[mike@x-ph.com]

Im stacking Cobb and Jb4, couldnt be happier. You have excellent customer support from terry, there is your free protune
If you decide to go that route let me know
If you decide to get a protune PTF guys do a wonderful job

[SalemChiro]

If you go with Cobb definitely get a ProTune, it's well worth it and transforms the car....not only power but drivability.

Since you're on Long Island, I'd make the drive to MA. and have a custom dyno tune done by BrenTuning.

Good Luck

[StormTrooper]

Originally Posted by Zombie1

Yeah I want to stay away from e85 and meth all together as I plan on keeping the car till it dies. If I do get a protune I'd get a map for 93 and another map made for 100octane. I plan on also doing an LSD but that's a long ways off. Thanks for the input sir.

Funny you say all this b/c I had SAME exact questions last year. I have all full bolt on pretty much and Wavetrac LSD is to come when I get the money... Berk full exhaust, AR downpipes, AFE dual CAI, Active BOV/Charge pipe, AMS front mount. PLENTY fast, but I wanted more. Did my homework and decided to go with the COBB, for its just a flash and so user friendly. Love its display and the ease of changing maps. I vote COBB